when you and your preschooler need a schedule, and you have a baby?

[schmamy]

I am sensing more and more that it would really be helpful to my DS1 (age 4), and to me, if we had some sort of schedule/routine. We haven't had one since he was born. Which is crazy because I am the sort of type-A person who thrives on structure. But with feeding on cue and refusing to CIO, I had to be laidback, so other than his falling into a classic 2-3-4 pattern fairly early on (nap 2 hours after he woke up, nap 3 hours after he woke up from the first one, bedtime 4 hours after waking up from the second nap) - we never had a schedule.

Anyway, I'm just realizing that I would be a better mom, and I think my preschooler would thrive, if we had more structure to our day. The problem is, I have an almost-1yo who has NOT fallen neatly into the 2-3-4 pattern. His sleep is completely unpredictable. Some days he wakes up at 6:30 and other days he sleeps until after 8. Sometimes he goes right down for a morning nap, but only sleeps for 30-45 minutes; other times he sleeps for 1.5 hours; other times he skips the morning nap altogether. Sometimes he's ready for an afternoon nap immediately after lunch; other days he doesn't go down until 3:00. :banghead

WHAT DO I DO?! I feel like I'm going crazy over here. With one kid, it was easier to roll with it and be flexible. But this is not working for my older DS, or for me anymore. I feel like I can't make any kind of plans. How do you begin to work with a routine/schedule when your baby is so completely unpredictable? Is there a way to make it work that I just haven't thought of?

---------- Post added at 10:32 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:09 AM ----------

It's like, I look at my Ezzo-minded friend who has kids the same ages, and who has been schedule-feeding and has her kids on a strict nap schedule because they can just cry if they don't sleep. I say that's not how I want to do things...but it sure seems like her life runs a lot more smoothly. :-/ Now I know it's selfish for me to do what's not best for my children just so that it will make *my* life more convenient or smoother--which is why I let go of my preferences and went with the flow the first time around. But with kiddo #2, it's not about what's helping me anymore, you know? I feel like the way it's going right now is not good for my DS1 and my ability to engage with him (which is especially critical as he has language delays and needs some focused, specific, one-on-one work for those).

[Victorious]

:popcorn in a very similar place right now.

[MaySunflowers]

Mine are the same age difference as yours. My daughter started her nursery at age 3 and that is what got us in line and on a schedule. My younger one just came along period. He was the sort that LOVED the sling so he was generally not bothered. He seemed to easily figure out how to nap once during the structure we needed to make it to and from nursery.

No magic fix really, but that is what got it together for us. My second adjusted so much more easily to things than I expected.. it was just the way it was and he accepted it... of course there were days he was crabby but overall it worked itself out with most of the fretting on my part and not on the kids part.

[schmamy]

:bump

[arelyn]

subbin

We're with you. This would be so much easier if DS2 could nurse and nap anywhere like DS1 did. No such luck though. Hopefully someone out there has some advice.

[mom24]

Can you wake him up at the same time every day? That might help him fall into a more predictable rhythm of sorts.

[schmamy]

As for schedules for olders with routines for youngers . . . for me it's often been about setting a schedule/routine with the older child(ren) and then bringing the younger ones into it or out of it depending on what is going on. So I might be homeschooling from a recliner while I nurse a baby down but we're doing math if it's time for math ;)

C&Ping Crystal's advice from another thread...I feel like I can see how this would work if 1) the baby was still really little and would sleep anywhere, or 2) the activity for the older kid was not very hands-on, just needed my presence and words/attention. But neither is the case. DS2 gets nursed to sleep in a quiet room, where I can immediately transfer him to his crib after he falls asleep. Trying to nurse him to sleep with his very interesting big brother present would not work. And the stuff I need to be doing with DS1 is a lot more hands-on. Specifically, I need to be getting on the floor playing with him, and doing speech therapy activities.

I think the first thing I need to do is to actually write down how our day goes for a week or so. Maybe once I can see everything (wake-up times, nap times, etc) in black and white, I'll be able to think more clearly about options (or can post it here for help brainstorming).

[mamaKristin]

A couple of ideas. I'd look into starting a routine around food for your older. When I would schedule meals/snacks, it was a great starting place to fill everything else in. Food for you and your older one that is. Also, take notes on what your younger one does when - there might be more pattern than you think. Do you have a carrier for your younger son? I did a lot of cooking and hands on parenting with my youngest in a backpack carrier :yes That helped fill up her need for mommy time, while giving me free hands to help the older two out with things. That helped me fill up everyone's need for mommy time so that I could take some quiet time out to go nurse baby to sleep when needed.

I don't know if you have tried any of these, but just some thoughts :)

[klpmommy]

I'd work on getting him up at approx the same time every day. With a consistent(ish) wake up time you might find his naps fall into a better pattern.

Also, I find the best schedule for us isn't a true schedule, but a routine. I have blocks of my day that I fit things into.

My current blocks are from wake up - 7am. Then 7-9, 9-12, 12-2, 2-4, 4-after dinner, after dinner - bedtime. For example, 12-2 includes lunch (we ate at 11:40 today), computer time for the bigs (they will do it in a bit) and reading to me, dancing with everyone, science or art or music activity. They are busy with oobleck right now so our computer and reading time will probably spill over into the next block.

You are at the hard nap age where every.single.stinkin'.thing. keeps the one who needs to nap up. It is such a hard stage!!!!

[Starfox]

I have a 4.5 yo, 21mo old and 5 mo old. What we've done that helps is I drew a schedule with pictures of what we do in the day. There are no timeframes on the schedule, just pictures. It helps the 4yo know what is next, even if we don't get to it at the same *time* every day, we do the same stuff in the same order.

The loop that gets thrown in is when we leave and go places, but we use lunch as a day divider and take up where we left off.

The 21 month old surprised me... One day, frustrated from trying to rock him to sleep, I laid him in his pack and play, gave him his favorite lovie, told him nigh night, kissed him and sat in the other room nursing the baby. He fell asleep without a peep. :jawdrop DS1 would have NEVER done that, and I honestly and unfairly thought that the only kids that would do this are ones who had CIO. We NEVER CIO. So now, 2 months later, that's how it works. He totally expects it and cheerfully toddles to his pack and play signing "sleep." :jawdrop

[PrincessAnika]

:think would the younger one play quietly in a PNP with some toys for a bit while you worked with the older one? maybe right after breakfast?

[ReadingMommy]

My kids are 3.5 yrs and 14 mos, and I can relate to this! My youngest has always been pretty unpredictable with her naps, and this is especially difficult now that she gets distracted so easily and doesn't currently have a good sleeping spot where I can leave her by herself (She falls asleep nursing, and it's very hard to transfer her. She always wakes up when I try to move her to the pack n play and we don't use a crib with her...I'm getting ready to put a twin mattress on the floor for her naps). Anyway...it's a work in progress with us too! We do have a loose routine after everybody's awake (my kids usually do wake up about the same time):
-Kids play while I try to get myself going
-Breakfast
-Try to do a few chores and get everybody ready to go (this takes a long time and usually involves a break for nursing and possible nap for 14 mo old)
-Go out (errands, gym, park, etc)
-Lunch
-Reading Time
-Quiet Time (3.5 yr-old plays by himself in his room for about an hour or sometimes lays down for a short nap if he's really tired. I use this time to veg out on the couch and nurse dd. Sometimes she falls asleep and sometimes she doesn't!)
-Next we have the long stretch of time between Quiet Time and when my husband gets home from work...I'm still working on the best routine for this time! If I'm really on the ball, I'll get baths done before he's home and start dinner but that's pretty ambitious! Sometimes I'm doing good just to hang out with the kids and try to keep ds busy with play dough or coloring or toys.

Our routine is pretty loose and leaves a lot of wiggle room. If it were just me and ds, I think it would be a bit more full/structured, but this seems to be the best I can do when taking dd's needs into account. Now that the weather's bearable again (we're in TX!), I want to incorporate a daily outdoor running around time in there somewhere. Maybe after Quiet Time before DH gets home. Thanks for posting this topic! I'll be watching to see what advice others have too!

---------- Post added at 06:01 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:59 PM ----------

Just wanted to add...we don't have a need for therapy time, but I have been wanting to do some preschool-type lessons with DS and I know...it's pretty hard to keep the little one occupied during that time! I hope you are able to figure out a good solution!

---------- Post added at 06:12 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:01 PM ----------

I just thought of kind of a weird idea and I don't know if it would work or not but thought I'd throw it out there. I was thinking of when my dd is the most content to just sit and be patient, and it's when she's in her high chair eating. Would it be possible to feed the kids separately? Let the little one eat while you're doing PT nearby with the older one, and then eat with the older one or nurse the little one or whatever while he's eating? Or have a special snack for the little one that takes a LONG time to eat while doing PT (lots of very tiny pieces:yes)

[HomeWithMyBabies]

My ds1 and ds2 were the same way with their naps. Ds1 was super predictable and ds2 was all over the place! I was so sleep deprived that whole first year, because he didn't sleep well at night either. He spent a lot of nap times in the sling in the first year, or I'd steal a nap here and there with him, and by the time he was a toddler I could nurse him to sleep just about anywhere and lay him down for a nice long afternoon nap. It took some time for him to get used to ignoring all the noise but now if he's tired he'll drop off anywhere (I have a picture of him sleeping in a stadium seat at a ball game) whereas my ds1 needs white noise, his bear, a flashlight and his music in order to even entertain the notion of sleeping.

What kind of exercises do you need to do with your oldest? We do a good many therapeutic activities during the day, they are integrated into the routine of the day and this works very well for us.

Now I have a third baby and a busy schedule of therapies outside the home. There really isn't any other option but to roll with it. He catches some shut eye in the car and I try to be home in the afternoon to maintain that as down time for everyone.

[WingsOfTheMorning]

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