The connection between s3x and 'discipline'

[Chris3jam]

I've been pondering all this "history of s3x" stuff. . . spanking. . . .s3x. . . .deviant behaviour . . ...etc. :scratch All these threads have me trying to nail things down. :think :glasses

Spanking and s3x (when twisted the world's way) are all about control and power. The same way rape is not about s3x. . it's about control and exercising power over someone else. This may be part of the reason the two get twisted together so easily. The more I live in my house, with my dh. . .I *see* the connection. Some people really need to be in control. This may be because they feel so out of controland powerless, either because they themselves were so controlled when younger, or because they are all about a lot of the things Berg teaches (getting 'sin nature' under control) - -- maybe it's a subconscious reaction to *knowing* that none of us is in control of anything. . .. only God is. Spanking, to me, has become nothing to do with discipline, the same way s3x, in a healthy and holy marriage, should be about love and not 'control' or 'domination' or 'conquering'. The line between 'help your children have self-discipline' and 'control your child' has been crossed. The waters are murky and I cannot imagine how many people who turned out just "fine" struggle with private demons and don't even know it.

Just me. . . ..rambling again. . . .. :O

[Jenny]

I cannot imagine how many people who turned out just "fine" struggle with private demons and don't even know it.


I agree. I have only recently started dealing with some of the things that I think are related to me being spanked as a child.

[diamondintherough]

Great observation, Chris. Once again, your post resonates with me and is applicable to my life. Do you think our dh's could be brothers and not know it? :giggle

The flip side to what you've said, of course, is that many of us who have been controlled for much of our lives end up choosing a partner who will control also and we naturally choose the submissive role because it's what we're used to. I think this is because we (me) don't know how to be in control of our own lives. In some ways I find that controlling situations is scary because I didn't have the ability to exercise that muscle when I was younger. It's kind of a vicious cycle. People who have been controlled need to have control, but watch out when two people who have been controlled get together--one of them will be dominant. :shrug It's the ultimate power struggle. If you've been controlled you have to choose to either control or be controlled.

I'm thinking out loud right now, but your post really got me pondering the whole situation. Not sure if I'm making any sense...

[Chris3jam]

Not sure if I'm making any sense...

You are. :hug2

I've been pondering it further. . . . .and you extended it perfectly. . .and describe a lot of the struggle I am going through right now. I have always been 'micro-managed'. Now, as a 43 yo mother of 4, I cannot seem to dredge up the "self-discipline" to get *anything* done, without someone telling me or something 'hanging over' me. I rely *way* too much on outside motivators. . . .it's like I cannot function without them. I used to keep my house clean when the "threat" of someone coming over was real . . .and I wanted to make sure that they were comfortable and wouldn't "see" me as an unChristian slob. :blush Now, though. . .it's just us. No one comes over. My house is a complete mess. . .the motivation is gone. No controls. . whatsoever. I'm flailing about, trying to grab onto something. . . .and, yet, when dh comes along and "bosses" me, I dig in my heels further and things get *much* worse. It's weird. . .but, I really started to think about a lot of this when I read one of John Holt's books on learning. And I *saw* myself. And how I rely so much on outside controls. . . ..but, yet, *hate* them!

And, yes, it's scary! We don't want the "responsibility" of being "in control". If something goes wrong, we can say, "It's not my fault! I just did what I was told!" And, yet. . .we're struggling.

Still thinking out loud. . . .it's an total spider web of repercussions. Twang one line, and you 'jiggle' the *whole* thing, without even knowing where or who did the twanging, or when.

[diamondintherough]

:hug2

I can soooo relate! The more I think about our "issues", the more I realize that it's not so much about GBD with the kids (although that is a big factor), but about control and the "dance" we always dance with control. I find that when I assert myself, that I'm quickly put back in my "place" (and sometimes I put myself back in my "place). It's gotten to the point where I don't bother anymore. I hate the way things are, but it takes too much effort to stand up for myself and I'm really sorry when I do because my life becomes more miserable than it was prior. I've "learned" that it's not worth it. And, of course, being in the church environment I'm in, there is no support there, just that I should submit to my husband "in all things" :sick.

Before I left MA, I was working with my counselor on becoming more assertive. It was never comfortable for me, but I was doing it to a certain degree. Things got much worse before they got better (he would tighten his grip more whenever I rose above how I was feeling in order to stand up to him), but then got a little better. I think we've "backslidden" on this because after all we've been through in the past year, I have no energy left to fight anymore.

BTW--I'm a "messy" too and I sometimes wonder if my house wouldn't be cleaner if I didn't have someone hanging over me all the time reminding me (not always with words) about what a terrible housekeeper I am. For now, I'll just blame it on PPD and the fact that I have ADD ;)

Well, this is getting kind of personal and I don't mind continuing it here, but if you prefer to move to a more private forum or pm with me instead, that's fine.