My boss gave me a Pearl book

[abbzchld]

Oh my.

My boss bought a copy of Helpmeet for all the women in our building about 6 months ago. I honestly didn't even look at the title when she handed it to me...I didn't have time to read it anyway. She told me it was about submission...maybe that is why I forgot about it! I tossed it in a desk drawer.

She asked me yesterday if I had read the book. I said I'd forgotten about it (true). Pulled it out today and oh my, saw the title. Now what?

My boss and I are close but I know she believes strongly in spanking. She told me to begin "popping" the bottom of dd's foot when she was just weeks old. I've totally avoided deepening that conversation. We have wonderful talks on other issues...vaxing, bf'ing, NCB, grace (!). We pray together often. She is my mom's age and I do see her as a mentor in some areas. I don't want this to turn ugly.

First...it is so strange that she would give us such an extreme book. Second...I am a state employee in a very secular environment so this is a little (um, a lot) inappropriate. Third...she is my boss.

What do you think? Ideas on how to handle this one?

Julie

[hsgbdmama]

:glasses Putting on business instructor hat here (have taken (managment, organizational & H/R) and taught (managment) business classes). <<Clearing throat>>

This is way out of line. Does your company have an H/R department? Alert them to this -- your boss is (a) interfering with your personal lives without being asked to do so; (b) is this the way she wants to be submitted to and (c) she is infriging upon peoples' religious beliefs (even though this is not a government business, many private businesses are following suit in order to avoid discrimination and harassment lawsuits).

[Teacher Mom]

Wow! That definitely puts you in an awkward position! I do think it is out of line, but she probably doesn't even realize it. :shrug

[CelticJourney]

"Well, I already had quite a list of books to read before I get to that: Grace Based Parenting, Biblical Parenting, The Ministry of Parenting Your Baby by Sears, the Suble Power of Spiritual Abuse.........It might take quite awhile for me to get to it."

[Maggie]

"Well, I already had quite a list of books to read before I get to that: Grace Based Parenting, Biblical Parenting, The Ministry of Parenting Your Baby by Sears, the Suble Power of Spiritual Abuse.........It might take quite awhile for me to get to it."

:yes :giggle

Could you just tell her it's not the type of book you're interested in reading? I suppose you could just continue to bean dip...

[abbzchld]

"Well, I already had quite a list of books to read before I get to that: Grace Based Parenting, Biblical Parenting, The Ministry of Parenting Your Baby by Sears, the Suble Power of Spiritual Abuse.........It might take quite awhile for me to get to it."


I love that! I did actually give her my Kimmel book when she was having some struggles with her teen daughter a couple of months ago. I totally forgot I loaned it to her. Wonder if she read it? Maybe I can defer to that. "I haven't gotten a chance. Have you read the book I gave you? How are things going with your dd?"

It could work.

I'm not comfortable with taken the grievance route. It really isn't worth that process and could have some horrible consequences for her.

[3PeasInAPod]

"Well, I already had quite a list of books to read before I get to that: Grace Based Parenting, Biblical Parenting, The Ministry of Parenting Your Baby by Sears, the Suble Power of Spiritual Abuse.........It might take quite awhile for me to get to it."



I'm not comfortable with taken the grievance route. It really isn't worth that process and could have some horrible consequences for her.


I wouldn't report her either. She probably thought she was helping & I'm assuming she is a Christian.
I would tell her you appreciate her gift, but it's not a book you agree with. If it were me, I'd just tell her I practice AP & gentle discipline.

[TulipMama]

This is way out of line. Does your company have an H/R department? Alert them to this -- your boss is (a) interfering with your personal lives without being asked to do so; (b) is this the way she wants to be submitted to and (c) she is infriging upon peoples' religious beliefs (even though this is not a government business, many private businesses are following suit in order to avoid discrimination and harassment lawsuits).

I wouldn't want to get her in trouble, either, but I don't think this should be ignored.

I would want to say something like this, "You know, we have a good relationship--praying together, encouraging one another in the Lord. You mean a lot to me. And given that we work for the state, I'm really concerned that you giving out the Debi Pearl book could cause problems for you. I know your intentions were good and of course I'm not going to file a complaint with HR, but there are women in our department from a wide range of backgrounds and even though you are seeking to encourage marriages, this could be considered harassment. I just want to alert you. . ."

[Joyce]

I would just tell her that you have heard of the author and the book, but you do not think it is going to be one that you agree with.

I would not report her, either.

If the discipline topic came up again, I might tell her that there are ways of disciplining that do not include smacking or spanking, and that you are going to give that your best.

I do not know how your supervisor is, but my former supervisor had a hard time taking "No" for an answer. I usually tried to gently disagree with her to avoid lengthy lectures or as you said to prevent anything "turning ugly".

[greenemama]

alexandra -- you always have such a nice way of dealing with things like this! :heart

[abbzchld]

Now I'm wondering if I should read the book. If I read it, I will end up slipping into my crusader mode. That usually isn't great for the workplace. But I'm sickly intrigued. I have it sitting in front of me right now...staring at the cover...reading the back. Ok, I put it away. Maybe later.

[CelticJourney]

I wouldn't - it's toxic. I have lost a lot of respect for a 'friend' who is a Pearlite because I know what she is open about that goes on in her home and I know where it comes from.

[Dizzy Blond]

There is somewhere on their site that Debi Pearl says that women should stay married to their husbands, even after he has mollested their kids. And that its the wife's fault if the husband beats her. So you can tell her that you can't possibly take the book seriously when she says that and you threw it in the trash (where it belongs).

[RubySlippers]

First...it is so strange that she would give us such an extreme book.

Just to clarify, the CTBHHM book is about marriage, not discipline, so there shouldn't be a need to get into discipline styles with your boss. :shrug
That being said, Debbie Pearl does plug reading TTUAC. :rolleyes

[hsgbdmama]

On p. 263 of the book (in the section that M. Pearl writes), he states that "some abuse" should be allowed in order to keep the chain of authority intact. :hunh :banghead :hissyfit :bheart

This book is chock full of their bad theology :sick2 ... unless you feel you can withstand it, stay away from it.

[abbzchld]

Just to clarify, the CTBHHM book is about marriage, not discipline, so there shouldn't be a need to get into discipline styles with your boss. :shrug

Yes and so far, I have avoided that discussion.

I just read page 263. I don't even have the words to describe what I feeling. I'm just...no, I don't even have words. I have skimmed through their website before and I read TTUAC. I didn't think I could be shocked by anything else they could say. I really...still no words.

[Dizzy Blond]

I'm just...no, I don't even have words.


You can just tell your boss that yes you've read the book and just what you said here. If people think this kind of advice is actually helpful to building up your marriage then there isn't much you can do to explain. :sick Stick to Dr. Laura and go tickle your husband's biceps instead. ;)

[hsgbdmama]

Okay, this has driven me to start looking through this piece of excrement poop garbage junk "work" (and I use that term loosely :rolleyes ), and here are the commonalities I am seeing:

* The woman needs to depend on her actions to get her out of trouble. Case in point: starting on p. 28, a woman writes to Mrs. Pearl about an emotional affair that her husband is having with his secretary. Here are parts of the nuggets that Mrs. Pearl responds with (bolded items are hers):

God has provided for your husband's complete sanctification and deliverance from temptation through you, his wife.

:scratch

If you want to keep your man and the father of your children, you are going to have to forget your rights as a wife and forget his Christian obligation to his vows. You must act as if you and the secretary are engaged in open competition for this man. Your husband is going to love what is lovely to him. You must be more lovely than she. You must beat her at her own game.

Throughout this whole letter, there is not ONE mention of laying things at the foot of the cross, not ONE mention of needing to fall to her knees in prayer to the Father.

It is in your best interest to learn to use feminine wiles.

:hunh

The tool of your warfare is your loving, kind, delightful, radiant, adoring self.

Not faith? Not the armor listed in Ephesians? Not prayer?

God is mentioned near the end of the letter, but only to remind the reader that one of His names is Jealous. No, God is not mentioned until the last sentence:

God is on your side. Fight and win.

:hissyfit :banghead

* The book is filled with only more of this, with Scripture being used conveniently to thump the woman up the side of the head.
* The book is utterly lacking in grace (you can take the "Dumb Cluck" test on p. 218 -- FTR, I'm a partial dumb cluck :shifty )
* Full of contradictions, baseless conclusions and unscientific "evidence."

Just ugh. :sick2

[Quiteria]

This is way out of line. Does your company have an H/R department? Alert them to this -- your boss is (a) interfering with your personal lives without being asked to do so; (b) is this the way she wants to be submitted to and (c) she is infriging upon peoples' religious beliefs (even though this is not a government business, many private businesses are following suit in order to avoid discrimination and harassment lawsuits).

I wouldn't want to get her in trouble, either, but I don't think this should be ignored.

I would want to say something like this, "You know, we have a good relationship--praying together, encouraging one another in the Lord. You mean a lot to me. And given that we work for the state, I'm really concerned that you giving out the Debi Pearl book could cause problems for you. I know your intentions were good and of course I'm not going to file a complaint with HR, but there are women in our department from a wide range of backgrounds and even though you are seeking to encourage marriages, this could be considered harassment. I just want to alert you. . ."





This is more in line with Matt 18, to always speak directly to a brother (or sister, I presume) in Christ about any problems ("sin against you") before involving others.

I agree that it would be a good thing to gently point this out as Tulipmama suggest. What an awful witness to suggest this book as a starting place. :jawdrop If she really wants to share her faith, acknowledging God in her life and sharing the gospel to those who seem interested or ask more questions...not handing out Christian-living books that are going to be meaningless to non-Christian employees, and especially not someone so controversial. :no2

[phathui5]

I would give the book back. Sooner than later. Maybe go through and highlight the parts that bother you and tell her you did so, so that she can see why you're returning it.

[gentlemommy]

.

[abbzchld]

She told me to begin "popping" the bottom of dd's foot when she was just weeks old.

Slightly OT, but :jawdrop What possible reason did she give why it would ever be appropriate to hit a newborn?? :mad :mad :mad :mad Even the most staunch Pearlites I know have never suggested that. :no2


She just kept saying that her doctor told her that she needed to do that "right from the start." I just pretended that I didn't hear and changed the subject. At the time, I was a very new mama and only knew that was BAD...didn't really have tools to debate with her. She's a pretty strong personality.

I am going to give the book back. I told her yesterday that I had not read it b/c of something I'd read on the Pearl website...about Debi not reading from the Bible to her children b/c the man should be the only one to open the scriptures to children. I knew that would strike a nerve in my boss who was a single mom for a while. She was pretty shocked and quickly backtracked that she didn't agree with everything in the book...some was extreme. We were interrupted so the conversation ended. But I felt great that the conversation stayed positive. When I give the book back to her I'll speak more on why I didn't read it and maybe touch on my decisions on gentle discipline.

Julie

[Katherine]

She just kept saying that her doctor told her that she needed to do that "right from the start."
I'm surprised and horrified that a doctor would openly advocate that.

Slightly OT, but What possible reason did she give why it would ever be appropriate to hit a newborn?? Even the most staunch Pearlites I know have never suggested that.

FTR, Pearl's writings support parents hitting their children as early as they deem it appropriate. He says that training should begin 1 year before the child's first birthday, and of course there is no ambiguity about his definition of training (swatting). TTUAC contains examples of switching a child as young as 3 months--it's been some time, but I believe it was for arching his back and crying when laid in a crib. :cry

There are a lot of people out there who recommend his books and support his teachings, but don't follow them to the letter, and might be pretty shocked and upset if they could see the literal incarnation of the teachings they are passing on to others. :(

[Quiteria]

I am going to give the book back. I told her yesterday that I had not read it b/c of something I'd read on the Pearl website...about Debi not reading from the Bible to her children b/c the man should be the only one to open the scriptures to children. I knew that would strike a nerve in my boss who was a single mom for a while. She was pretty shocked and quickly backtracked that she didn't agree with everything in the book...some was extreme. We were interrupted so the conversation ended. But I felt great that the conversation stayed positive. When I give the book back to her I'll speak more on why I didn't read it and maybe touch on my decisions on gentle discipline.

Julie


:tu :pray
Let us know how it goes.:) (Though of course sometimes we never find out how long it takes for the seeds we plant...)

[hsgbdmama]

I am going to give the book back. I told her yesterday that I had not read it b/c of something I'd read on the Pearl website...about Debi not reading from the Bible to her children b/c the man should be the only one to open the scriptures to children. I knew that would strike a nerve in my boss who was a single mom for a while. She was pretty shocked and quickly backtracked that she didn't agree with everything in the book...some was extreme. We were interrupted so the conversation ended. But I felt great that the conversation stayed positive. When I give the book back to her I'll speak more on why I didn't read it and maybe touch on my decisions on gentle discipline.

:yes :tu :highfive