What is the secret to a peaceful, harmonious home?

[Chris3jam]

Is it obedient/compliant children, children under control, like all the parenting gurus say? Is the only way to have a calm and happy parent is having the children under control and cooperative? I must say, that having such trouble with my kiddos . . . . it really would be nice to have a peaceful home . . . .one that's harmonious. Dh says he hates to come home because it's just a big struggle all the time to parent the kids. Even if all he has to do is listen to the arguing, the fighting and the complaining and seeing the mommy (by mommy, I mean me) in tears all the time. I have to admit to comparing my kids to other kids I see. And I see parents under control. . . I see calm kids. . . I see cooperative kids. . .. . I see happiness. I look around my home. . . I see chaos (not in a good way). . . I see pinched faces, rotten attitudes. . . ..

Let me 'splain. . .just one example. Swimming lessons. I cannot afford them for all. .. so I pay for dd to get them (since the boys know how already - - - they had lessons, too), and the boys can swim in the other lanes while she is having her lessons. For me. . .great! They are getting exercise. . . .it's free for them (for any family member at any time while she's enrolled there), etc. EXCEPT. . . . .all they do is futz around. :( Swipe at each other with the kick boards, splash each other, etc. They aren't getting any exercise, and they're most likely kinda bugging the other people (who are too polite to say it). :( Now. . .. I see the other kids. And the mom says, "ok, guys, let's go swimming!" And the kids actually swim!! See. . .they've been taught to "obey". . . .and the mom isn't stressed. . the kids get much-needed exercise. . . and everybody is happy.

What am I doing that's so wrong that *we* cannot have a happy, wonderful family? Is there not a non-punitive way to elicit cooperation/compliance/obedience from kids? Yes, they had to get out of the pool, and that absolutely did not solve the problem of needing exercise, which led to increased hyperactivity at home, and even further "non-happiness". Everybody is "losing" at my house. :(

[Susan K]

When you see parents who look like their children are perfect remember you do not see them at their house. At times my dc are wonderfully behaved. Then at times I am ready to tear out my hair. About the pool,is it possible to have a different energy out activity on the days when the pool does not work out.
Susan

[milkmommy]

:hug2 I think this is a difficult question to really answer. I wont lie I know when I have coperation from DD life is MUCH more enjoyable and when we don't It makes me just want t go away and leave her someplace :shifty. SO I can't say that well behaved children don't bing some degree of peace. At the same time what makes a "well behaved child" can differ and I think we need to be careful to keep a real outlook on life. Many families who seem just so ideal on the outside are seriously hurting on the inside.

Deanna

[Savmom]

I am not sure what the dynamics are for you at home, but I am learning that when I am calm regardless of what is going on around me, things tend to be more peaceful. When I started removing the expectation from the dc of instant compliance or obedience to keep ME feeling at peace, I actually felt more peaceful, if that makes any sense. My dc are "good" sometimes and "not so good" sometimes (when speaking from a punitive mindset that is). But if I respond with the same attitude they are bothering me with (ie they are irritable, and I let it make me irritable) my day is shot. But, if they are being annoying or grouchy or fussy or whining (which happens more often than not) and I keep my composure, stay calm and demonstrate how I *wish* they would act, I stay at peace within myself and they calm down and the behavior gradually changes. This has been an *epiphany* of sorts for me because I was raised by an alcoholic father and drug addicted mother who were VERY punitive--mean and abusive really. I saw so much of my parents in myself as a new mom and just could not seem to stop. Yelling happened much more than talking did (ds started wearing ear plugs around me :shifty ) not to mention shoving, pushing, spanking :cry and we were all miserable. After realizing that something had to change or we were all going to kill each other, I started really studying my bible for the first time ever and God led me here. I came to see that MY attitude and irrational behavior was setting the tone for how the kids responded and acted. And until I got myself feeling better and got my emotions under control there was no way I could ever help my kids behave better.

Sorry to make this about me. I did not answer your questions at all, did I?

:hugheart

[Rbonmom]

One thing that always stresses me out is when I feel like other people are disapproving, it's even that much harder when there's also disapproval coming from within (your dh). I tend to feel harsh or punitive toward ds in those situations, so I'm learning to step back and see what's really going on. Are they harming anyone? Are they just being boys? Are they being disrespectful to those around them? If not, if they're just being more rowdy and less focused than you want, than don't worry about it :shrug Keep in mind too that you have active boys, and even if they are "futz'ing" it's still some activity. If they were laying on the side of the pool, staring at the ceiling then I'd be worried :laughtears
I think because of the focus of those around you (your church, your dh, etc...) you wind up looking for the things everyone is doing wrong, vs. looking for what's going right.
Is there a way you could stop letting dh know about your frustrations, and only tell him the positive stuff? I know that sounds odd, but having been married to a emotionally abusive guy, if I ever let him see any weakness he would just use it against me and I felt so overwhelmed by that :no2 Obviously your dh will be able to see for himself what's happening, but honestly there is so much power in praise and focusing on positive that you might be surprised that he would start seeing the positives too. Plus, (and I know this is a big generalization) most guys feel really helpless when they see their wife struggling and don't know what to do, and then that can turn into anger and frustration at the wife, because they feel unable to help. Don't know if that makes sense, but that was certainly a bad dynamic in my marriage.
:hug2

[ArmsOfLove]

YOu don't get a peaceful, harmonious home by forcing children to be quiet and compliant. You get cooperative and helpful children by raising them in a peaceful and harmonious home. You get a peaceful and harmonious home by being in a healthy marriage with healthy boundaries. You can't fix things by making your children quiet and compliant. They are a barometer for the condition of the home, not the cause of it.

[MarynMunchkins]

The secret to a peaceful home? It has to be empty. ;)

:shrug Crystal summed it all up perfectly, so I'll just say "Yeah -- that." :)

[Chris3jam]

Sorry to make this about me. I did not answer your questions at all, did I?

You didn't. And, you did. ;) Thanks.

Ok.. .. . I'm taking this kind hard. . . . .the problem is me, right? :cry

[MarynMunchkins]

No. :scratch Actually, I would say the bigger problem is a lack of harmony between you and dh. But that's JMHO. :O

[milkmommy]

Ok.. .. . I'm taking this kind hard. . . . .the problem is me, right? cry or very sad
No :hug2 :cry

Deanna

[ArmsOfLove]

No. :scratch Actually, I would say the bigger problem is a lack of harmony between you and dh. But that's JMHO. :O
right--this is what I meant.

Chris--I'm so not about blame :no that would be unhelpful. At the same time, what is within your power to change???

[Chris3jam]

At the same time, what is within your power to change???

That was sort of where I was going. The only thing I can change is me. And I'm sooooo bad about change. I don't take to it well at all. :(

[ArmsOfLove]

change is hard for me too :hug2

[Elena]

Hey, there. I don't have much to say except :hug2. You probably don't remember, I've been out of the loop for a long while now (used to post as MamatoLLL) but you really encouraged me a few times when I was going through some rough times with my kids. I don't even remeber what my exact issues were that I posted about or what you said, I just remember YOU and that I appreciated you. Anyway, I'm back now, and I saw your name, read your post, and wanted to send :hug2 your way.

[Zipporah]

if I respond with the same attitude they are bothering me with (ie they are irritable, and I let it make me irritable) my day is shot. But, if they are being annoying or grouchy or fussy or whining (which happens more often than not) and I keep my composure, stay calm and demonstrate how I *wish* they would act, I stay at peace within myself and they calm down and the behavior gradually changes.


Admittedly, I only have one dd but I have found this to be very true.

Oh, and what Crystal said as well

[Chris3jam]

You probably don't remember, I've been out of the loop for a long while now (used to post as MamatoLLL) but you really encouraged me a few times when I was going through some rough times with my kids. I don't even remeber what my exact issues were that I posted about or what you said, I just remember YOU and that I appreciated you. Anyway, I'm back now, and I saw your name, read your post, and wanted to send your way.

I remember you! :hug :) Um. . .I don't remember the things I said, though. :O :bag And thanks. . . .it's just that I guess the kids are getting older and things are changing *fast* here, and I'm a bit :nails lost. :(

[katiekind]

What is the secret to a peaceful, harmonious home? Is it obedient/compliant children, children under control, like all the parenting gurus say? Is the only way to have a calm and happy parent is having the children under control and cooperative?

I have three thoughts for you. For one thing, some happy homes have boisterous, energetic, passionate, imaginative, playful, noisy parents and children with lots of shouting up and down the staircase, thunderous romping and stomping, wrestles and tussles breaking out all over and children who never walk down the middle of a hallway but carom off the walls instead, etc.

So I want to say that some home-life ideals that we latch onto in our imaginations are a little anemic and tightly-wound by comparison to the richness of real life with children--at least in some families.

Secondly, yes, harmony starts with the grownups, it really isn't going to start with the kids and it's not fair to expect them to feel and produce what the grownups in their lives don't have.

Thirdly, once a month, before my period, my home and family used to seem to go to the dogs -- and then miraculously, after my period arrived, they would suddenly shape up! Or perhaps my hormonal mix changes! ;) I don't know if PMS colors your evaluation of your family situation, but it tended to affect me greatly in that area, so I thought I'd mention it.

[Elena]

[I remember you! :hug :)

:) Yay I'm glad!

Um. . .I don't remember the things I said, though. :O :bag

Don't worry I don't remember what either of us said, :/, just that you were an encouragement to me! :heart

And thanks. . . .it's just that I guess the kids are getting older and things are changing *fast* here, and I'm a bit :nails lost. :(
[/quote]

I know what U mean- some things get a whole lot easier, like they are more independent, but just when I think we've conquered one issue another one pops up! That's why I put "ever-learning Mama" in my siggy. I just don't presume to know anything anymore. I started this parenting journey with so much pride and "knowledge" that was actually a bunch of baloney. "The more you know, the more you realize you don't know"

I agree with katiekind- my hormones affect the atmosphere of my home big time. One week things can feel completely horrible and the next, quite manageable and even enjoyable! And when I reflect back it wasn't so much the circumstances but more my perspective on things.

I know that's not much help, but anyway, I can relate.

(Sorry, I'm still not getting the quote thing right- I'll learn :O)

[cklewis]

What is the secret to a peaceful, harmonious home? Is it obedient/compliant children, children under control, like all the parenting gurus say? Is the only way to have a calm and happy parent is having the children under control and cooperative?

I have three thoughts for you. For one thing, some happy homes have boisterous, energetic, passionate, imaginative, playful, noisy parents and children with lots of shouting up and down the staircase, thunderous romping and stomping, wrestles and tussles breaking out all over and children who never walk down the middle of a hallway but carom off the walls instead, etc.

So I want to say that some home-life ideals that we latch onto in our imaginations are a little anemic and tightly-wound by comparison to the richness of real life with children--at least in some families.

Secondly, yes, harmony starts with the grownups, it really isn't going to start with the kids and it's not fair to expect them to feel and produce what the grownups in their lives don't have.

Thirdly, once a month, before my period, my home and family used to seem to go to the dogs -- and then miraculously, after my period arrived, they would suddenly shape up! Or perhaps my hormonal mix changes! ;) I don't know if PMS colors your evaluation of your family situation, but it tended to affect me greatly in that area, so I thought I'd mention it.


Ah. . . . Thank you for this. I've been reviewing your words over and over in my mind. They've been a great encouragement to me.

:hug

C

[Chris3jam]

I have three thoughts for you. For one thing, some happy homes have boisterous, energetic, passionate, imaginative, playful, noisy parents and children with lots of shouting up and down the staircase, thunderous romping and stomping, wrestles and tussles breaking out all over and children who never walk down the middle of a hallway but carom off the walls instead, etc.

So I want to say that some home-life ideals that we latch onto in our imaginations are a little anemic and tightly-wound by comparison to the richness of real life with children--at least in some families.

I really don't have a problem with "happy noise". That's just. . .neat. It's the sign that there is life and activity in the home. Paints scattered on the kitchen table, the masterpieces drying on (all) the counters, dd's tea set set up in the middle of the floor, her barbies gathered around it, the boys putting on their silk capes (yes, they still have them and use then!) and "flying" down the stairs, the empty box that's been employed as a "sled" to slide down the stairs, the dog that's "encouraged" to become an audience for a "book reading", the crystals growing on the window sill, the butterflies in their 'garden' in the corner, etc. That's me, though. Dh has a totally different idea of what is "proper". I don't subscribe much to convention. . .or proper. :giggle

BUT. . .what about the fights? The knock-down, drag out fights? The shoving so hard into walls that a hole is created? The shoving of the brother so hard off the couch that he almost goes through the window? The throwing of things at each other that cause damage to both person and walls and furniture? The older brother that sits on the younger, punching him repeatedly? That kind of thing? The way over the top thing? They are *intense*. They don't just 'tussle'. . . .they *fight* hard. How does one deal with that kind of thing?

[katiekind]

I don't have wisdom there. My boys related to each other physically quite a bit. Playful wrestling and tussling fueled by youthful boy energy could morph into angry physical fighting if someone got hurt during the playful part. Additionally, it does seem like there's some parts of it that are moments of serious struggles for dominance, and if I recall rightly, the presence of Dad was helpful, but sometimes I would have to call up my inner alpha male and settle them back down. It was a behavior that diminished as they got older. They are good friends now.

Do they cooperate with each other and get along together quite a bit, too? My boys at that age did play together well (which of course made the fights all the more frustrating to me as their mom--why not just be the good buddies you usually are?) But anyways, we had both dynamics--they did wonderful stuff together AND fought.

Holes in wall--I don't think we ever had a hole in the wall at home...but I do remember laughing with other families about the kinds of things that happened in the course of their boys' growing up years. (Having friends with older boys than ours was always a blessing--to hear their stories was to know we weren't alone or weird.)

My youngest son did put a hole through a wall at church right after the paint dried in the long-awaited new sanctuary. Some kids were waiting to be picked up from youth group and the boys started running around and wrestling and boom...my son's knee was the one that went through the drywall. He and dh went down to the church later and patched it and repainted, but it was pretty embarrassing, and the patch job just wasn't as wonderfully smooth as the rest of the wall so that when the new room was dedicated that first Sunday...our eyes kept going to that one knee-shaped patched spot, which stood out a mile to us. :blush And it is there still.

[MidnightCafe]

Chris, I agree with many of the things that have already been said. I just wanted to point out something I noticed about the example you gave in your first post, about swimming. Is it possible that your boys *are* getting exercise, but not in the conventional way? When I go to the beach I don't expect to see kids "swimming" all the time.I see them jumping & hopping around in the water, wrestling, playing with balls & swim toys, building sandcastles, collecting rocks, splashing, etc. Most of that is still exercise. It just isn't lap swimming. SWIM?

The other thing I noticed is that you said people are probably annoyed by your boys but too polite to say anything. It's never a good idea to assume what other people might be thinking. As long as they aren't complaining, I really wouldn't worry about it. I know that part of the reason you worry is because your husband has a different idea of what is "proper" play and what isn't. I think, though, that there are tons of people out there who are just like you - believing that unstructured play makes way more sense. And, if they're anything like me, they think it's just plain weird if kids come and swim laps at the pool. :shrug

You are so hard on yourself. I'm sorry you're feeling so bad. :hug2

[Chris3jam]

Is it possible that your boys *are* getting exercise, but not in the conventional way? When I go to the beach I don't expect to see kids "swimming" all the time.I see them jumping & hopping around in the water, wrestling, playing with balls & swim toys, building sandcastles, collecting rocks, splashing, etc. Most of that is still exercise. It just isn't lap swimming. SWIM?

The other thing I noticed is that you said people are probably annoyed by your boys but too polite to say anything. It's never a good idea to assume what other people might be thinking. As long as they aren't complaining, I really wouldn't worry about it.

Well, they are being *way* too rambunctious (hitting each other with the kick boards and splashing everybody else as well as themselves, etc.). .. and get 'called down' from at least one of the instructors. This is not a community pool, as such, but a lap-swimming-training pool. They are bothering the other lap swimmers. . .. I can tell by the way they look at them, and look at me, like "Do something!". When they are soooo loud, they interfere with the instructions of the swim team leader (some of the swim team practices at that time, too), and about drown out the instructions of dd's instructor. :(

[Katigre]

What do you do when they start being wild at the pool?

[Chris3jam]

What do you do when they start being wild at the pool?

They have to get out and sit with me. Which totally defeats the purpose they are there. . .to get some exercise and activity. :( Then they are all hyper and wild at home. :(

[greenemama]

my kids do better with each other if i engage them really well for a good amount of time in spurts throughout the day. this includes outside time. i wish i could just sit in my chair and read the whole time, but they think i'm fun :hunh and if we play together first, i can sit for a good spell later.

i think we have dumb ideas (culturally, not you personally!) about what "peace" means. kathy's post really hit it -- happiness and peace doesn't mean quiet and complacency. there's a lot of "children should be seen and not heard" and other victorian garbage out there that still applies in a society that finds children and their zeal for life to be annoying.

great thread!

[katiekind]

I know the kind of lap pool you're talking about. I used to go to one three times a week. I brought my youngest and he would kind of play around the steps and practice handstands in the water and stuff like that and use a kickboard some but that was one boy. Two boys is a whole new world!

My boys at your kids' age would have been totally -- and I mean totally -- uninterested in swimming laps. That kind of disciplined approach to getting exercise for exercise's sake is not what boys that age generally do, particularly not in a pool.

I know you were thinking creatively about how to get all three kids some interesting and fun exercise for the price of one, and that was wonderful. Sometimes you have to let the dream go, though. It's not your children, it's the set-up. One idea, though--next time maybe they should accompany you and sit it out until close to the end of the time period. Then if they really really really want to go in, and if they understand the kind of quiet, calm play you expect of them, they could go in for a few minutes near the end of the time period. Or ?

[Chris3jam]

That kind of disciplined approach to getting exercise for exercise's sake is not what boys that age generally do, particularly not in a pool.

Well, they just really seemed to like trying new strokes and swimming and stuff. I even told them, "Hey! See if you can beat that guy!" in the next lane. But, it seems that they kind of lost that interest. :(

[katiekind]

But, it seems that they kind of lost that interest. But that sounds about right for that age, Chris. You were clever to appeal to them on their level by showing them different strokes to try and by throwing out the challenge of beating the guy in the next lane, though. But beyond that, yes, kids that age will lose interest.

[Sandollar]

can they take turns in the pool? one at a time? just a thought. I also wanted to share something (this may not be your situation at all) but growing up we were physically punished, not just spankings, hair pulling, slaps, etc. and my siblings and I fought hard, we would lash out at each other almost daily, I even needed stitches one time, after that we were more gentle w/ each other :rolleyes. I remember once my mom crying and saying how she'd wish we'd treat each other better. But how could we ? thats what was modeled in our home.
So, if youre changing from a punitive past,or spanking it may take them some time to figure out the fightings not Ok.
Just a thought... :hug2

[Lilly_of the_ Fields]

Just a thought: my oldest is only just 3 years old, but I notice a massive difference in his behaviour when he has any food with additives in it. Most recently, I've discovered I have a huge intolerance to a "natural" additive called annato (I get agitated, asthma etc) which is used to give colour to a huuuuuge amount of yellow food, esp dairy products (cheese, butter etc) and juices. It makes sense, as talking with my mum revealed that she found it wasn't the red food colouring that made me hyperactive as a child (although I'm sure it would not have helped! :D ) but that yellow food colouring made me go absolutley off my tree (apparently I swung off some curtains and overturned a cupboard after barricading myself in my bedroom with a mattress at age 3 :blush ). Anyway, I'm not saying it's necessarily the case with your kids (or they are even necessarily as bad as I was :laughtears ) but, it's really worth checking out. http://www.fedupwithfoodadditives.info/books/FUinfo.htm