The "I Mean Business" Voice

[Heather Micaela]

I have been brainwashed by Dobsin.
DTD sets of this scenario of the permissive parent sweetly asking a child to get ready to take a bath and then having the child do nothing. This process repeats itself till the mom yells and the child jumps into action. The conclusion by Dobsin is that the child has "figured out" that the parent doesn't mean it till the third time when the voice is raised. Dobsin's sugestion is that he obey the the first time or get a spanking.

There is a LOT wrong with that sceanario that could be solved w/o resorting to hitting.
#1 prepare the child that it is time to get ready for a bath in x minutes
#2 Don't ask - let the child know he *will* be getting ready for a bath
#3 If he doesn't comply (not "obey" :rolleyes) physically PUT the child in the tub

I was able to retrain my mind to combat MOST of the sceanario, but the part that still gets to me is that Dobsin says that a parent should not *have* to change tone to get a child to comply. So, anytime I use the "I am the mom and you need to do this - I mean business" voice, I feel like I have failed.

I have seen a grace based mom I look up to use this with her children. And I breathed such a sigh of relief that it was ok to not sound like Snow White everytime I spoke to my kids. Seriously, I had this idea that gentle discipline meant that you go around singining merrily throughout the day and the children gaily skipped behind you and did your bidding with glee as birds flutterd about your head and chipmunks scurried at your feet. Now I see that a better example is Mufassa disciplining Simba after he went to the elephant graveyard. Simba had a healthy respect for his dad and was not looking forward to being "taught a lesson." Funny thing was that wasn't a euphamism - he was actually teaching. His vioce was firm and even a bit intimidating (granted that was the same voice as Darth Vadar, but I digress...) Yet at the end the two romped and played.

So I understand the healthy use of such a voice. But the problem is I waiver between sugar and spice inefectiveness and almost permissiveness and going too far and yelling. And deep down I still feel guily when I tell my dc in the "voice" "you *need* to come here and stop _____(whatever)"

The other thing is that there is the temptaion to add "Or else" and I know that elicits an "or else WHAT" And TBH I have thrown in a punitive "what" from time to time.

So what is the corect timing and way to use that voice of authority w/o abusing it?

[MarynMunchkins]

If I can use the voice without feeling angry or threatening, I think it's fine. Stating the command in a more serious tone doesn't always mean I'm upset, KWIM? :)

[Sara]

:popcorn

[CelticJourney]

Well, if we all talked mono-tone all the time, life would be yicky. Communication involves variety. Even when I sign, I can emphasize words or emotions with my hands - it's an important part of meaning.

Dobson's idea puts the weight of constant attentiveness on the listener - and in this case, listeners who are little children who have a hard time focusing. Sometimes it is a change that is needed - and, hey, I've seen a whisper work as well, so.....

A good example of this was when my dd was about 7 and we were having a family dinner at my brother's house. Now db is stressed because his ex is being, well, herself and is on edge. He calls the kids to the table to eat and dd doesn't hear him because she is reading, a new skill that requires her full concentration. In an uncharacteristic move, he raises in an angry way and indicates she is ignoring him. My mother, who defines Mother Bear at moments, cuts him off completely, gently reminds him that reading is a new skill that requires all her attention and she obviously didn't hear because she is not a disrespectful child (go mama, go mama) and then calls out to her with a different, but not unkind tone and she comes running to eat. Dd was oblivous to the entire thing :phew, but the look on db's face of "well :doh, I should have thought of that" was priceless.

[SouthPaw]

hmmm, well i dont see why it is bad to use a "business" voice sometimes. we are social beings and we (kids included) cue off of things like tone and inflection, etc. it's just normal, the way babies like high pitched voices. now i do agree that you shouldn't have to rely on using the "mean voice" in order for a child to obey... but if you pull it out every now and then to help them cue into your intent and seriousness about a certain situation or action, thats just called human interaction/communication.

[ArmsOfLove]

but the part that still gets to me is that Dobsin says that a parent should not *have* to change tone to get a child to comply. So, anytime I use the "I am the mom and you need to do this - I mean business" voice, I feel like I have failed. But why not? Why shouldn't we have to do different things? Why can't we have the freedom to live in the moment and enjoy life and do what needs to be done? Why the oppressive legalism?

You haven't failed--but I know the idea is that you've "built" up to the "I mean business" voice. I actually think the Disney voice to start with is the problem :shrug A kind voice doesn't have to be wimpy--that's why I love the 5 Steps. I can just be casual but firm. Kind *and* firm is the balance :tu So, in a sense I agree with the idea that you "shouldn't have to" idea if it is part of the dynamic of asking repeatedly, reasoning and then getting angry and demanding. But his summation that changing the voice is the problem is the problem I have with his summation :scratch does that make sense? the *problem* that he is describing is that the parent isn't *being* the authority and the child senses that and doesn't respond to it. When you are *being* the authority you can be more relaxed about things and your children know you mean it ;)

[Katherine]

((( Heather )))

I felt the same relief you were talking about when I heard veteran GD moms talk about using it. :phew However, my personal experience has been that I do better when I try not to depend on a particular tone of voice to accomplish my parenting. The biggest problems with "the voice" are that it is nearly always negative and often (as you were describing) carries an implied threat--especially if you've come from punitive parenting and supplying the threat is second nature to you. :blush I found that using it actually MADE me get more upset, faster... :banghead :doh b/c I was essentially throwing down the gauntlet and then if the kids still didn't respond the way I wanted them to I was even more upset. :mad I tell my boys all the time to use words insteads of "sounds effects" (screaming, crying, yelling, growling, mean voices) to communicate their upset feelings, and I think I should try to live by the same standard. The other big problem was that when I am using it as a *tool* it's because I AM repeating my directives, or b/c I'm not wanting to actively engage a problem so I keep ramping up the vocal intensity hoping that I won't have to get more involved. :blush :shifty

I also think there's a ton of middle ground between the sugary-sweet voice and the clipped, stern "I mean business" voice. ;)
When I started exploring that territory, I found an unlimited number of ways to add feeling and draw attention to my words without being negative. :tu elcollins gave a great example of the sort of thing I'm talking about ... just a *different* attention catching tone... quiet, silly, grave, urgent, excited, etc.

In the end, I think the best kind of parenting doesn't depend on whether a child will respond to ANY certain tone, and therefore words are accompanied by active involvement as much as possible. Add to that the fact that any type of sterness in my voice tends to stoke up the embers of that punitive mindset I've had most of my life, and you've got a situation where *I* really need to avoid vocal negativity altogether.

NOTE: I DO use a very firm and intense voice at times and I'm not suggesting that it's even possible to parent without it. :lol :shifty It often just spills out in a moment of urgency or danger or serious infraction... and I'm already on my feet and on my way as it's coming out. I have no problem with that kind of thing. It's the *regular* use of a stern/harsh voice for daily issues, and the depending on that subtle threat of "Mom's serious now" that I dislike and try to avoid.

I actually agree with Dobson (did I *say* that? :laughtears ) wrt the fact that children can learn that they don't need to listen until Mom uses a particular tone of voice. It's not rebellion or purposeful defiance on the kids' part... they are simply behaving in accordance with the way they were taught. All instructions are suggestions or warnings until they hear "the voice" and only *then* does the instruction scenario begin. :rolleyes2 I disagree with him that physical violence is the best way to remedy the situation. ;)

[ArmsOfLove]

it can help you stop theatening if you add something silly to the "or else"--or else I will tickle you; or else I will act like a monkey; or else I will go clean the kitchen ;)

[Heather Micaela]

But his summation that changing the voice is the problem is the problem I have with his summation :scratch does that make sense?

:laughtears After I read it a few times it did.

Yeah I just got to locate that tape recorder in my head playing the message that I cant use that "voice" and take a sledgehammer to it. And FTR, Snow White wasn't dealing with children :giggle


it can help you stop theatening if you add something silly to the "or else"--or else I will tickle you; or else I will act like a monkey; or else I will go clean the kitchen ;)

I do that, but I need to remember to do that more often. Things can get intesne with emotional and behavoiral challenges spicing up the regular childhood discipline issues. Problem is Joshua get exasperated with my nonsense/silly talk. Get your shoes on or I am going to eat your toes used to get :giggle from him. Now I get :rolleyes "Stop being silly all the time, Mommy" (I guess I am already uncool in his eyes :P~)

[Mother of Sons]

I have an "I mean business voice" and I'm not against it but it doesn't work well for us. It producses alot of attitude in one of my kids, it works for one (but I think the attitude might just be stuffed instead of expressed) and the other one couldnt' care less about it other than to occassionally tell me that I am mean.

[J3K]

My "I mean business voice" was such a handle in my day I was using it several times a day to "get my point across." And like another poster said it did nothing for the kids but it made ME angrier.

So now when the situation calls for I drag out my man voice.

ex:

me: DD12 I need you to clean the kitchen now .

DD12: I'm right in the middle of a game, Can it wait ?

me: Look me in the eye when we talk please it shows respect , and no you may not wait. We've dillied long enough. Let's go.

DD12: (still playing but looking up this time) I'll be right there.(computer screen changes and she begins typing to a friend)

me: I'm going to use my man voice if you (long pause )[insert man voice]don't get off the computer right now.[/man voice]

DD12: Oh gross. (While walking to the kitchen) You know you don't sound like a man when you do that don't you ? It just sounds like you with your Minnie Mouse voice attempting to sound like a man. It's really quite sad.

me: I do a good man voice.

DD12 : No you don't. (kids from next room chorus too).

*******
There was a time I would've SHOUTED "Get off the computer NOW". True...it was trying my patience to watch her sit there and type. But shouting would've just made her upset and unable to do the dishes. By pulling out my "man voice" (which I say is pretty good ) it showed DD that I meant business.

[HomeWithMyBabies]

I do have a business voice. It's actually quieter than my usual speaking voice. Before I use it, I tell ds "Show me your eyes" or something to that affect, so he knows I'm going to follow through. I think the eyes are actually the key to my business voice. It makes a huge difference with ds.

[Marsha]

i am apparently unable to use the business voice either w/out being mean or producing attitude in my four year old. what works for me (besides yelling :no2 is getting in her face. nicely. I mean, getting beside her and looking her in the face when telling her to do something. I know when she's scattered and I should know better than to use verbal commands alone at those times, but sometiems I do, and it's my fault (mostly) when she ignores or acts like she does't hear me.
we are also working on saying "yes mommy" so I don't feel ignored cause that is a huge trigger for me. the "yes mommy" is just to acknowledge mostly that she HEARD me.

[Katherine]

we are also working on saying "yes mommy" so I don't feel ignored cause that is a huge trigger for me. the "yes mommy" is just to acknowledge mostly that she HEARD me.

We have to work on this a LOT at our house. :banghead I can frequently be heard saying, "You need to say something to let me know you heard me." And my 3yo right now has discovered the sticking-your-tongue-out-when-you-don't-like-what-is-said approach, which absolutely incenses dh.

dh and I were just talking last night about how not being acknowledged is a huge anger trigger for both of us, whether it be from the kids or from each other. :shifty

[Beauty4Ashes]

I found that I am lowering my voice an octave and speak more slowly and distinctly with my 2. If I try to use "the voice", I get angrier and it escalates to yelling and it's all downhill from there.

[Titus2Momof4]

Heather, I can relate to a lot of what you are wondering/doing in your post. I, too, always seem to have this idea that the ideal GD mama has this sweet, loving, Cinderella (that's what I always thought of lol) voice towards her kids at all times. It doesn't help that when I've been on the phone w/gd mamas, they DO sound this sweet and la la la towards the kids, no matter what they are doing in the background. Meanwhile, my own voice probably comes out as :mad when they do something to upset me :blush. Just wanted to let you know you aren't the only one who has felt this way! (nor the only one who has thrown in a desperate "or else what, or else this" before. My problem being that my "what" is really an empty threat and that does nothing but make me look like a fool in the end, lessening the chances of the kids taking me seriously :doh)

[hollybells]

it can help you stop theatening if you add something silly to the "or else"--or else I will tickle you; or else I will act like a monkey; or else I will go clean the kitchen ;)


:giggle Our "or else" is ... or else I'll have to squish you (in our home that's a fun thing :shifty) and that would be way too messy! :P