Spank them until they're sweet?

KSL · 07-28-2012, 01:47 PM

I believe this comes from SACH by Ted Tripp, correct?

for some reason I was thinking about this phrase ad concept before I went to bed last night. It just seems like such a logically incorrect way to approach discipline. Even IF you believed in spanking, why would you expect your kids, at age 2, 4, 6, whatever, to be "sweet" after you'd done it? Even for a natural consequence that comes with an action I do-- say, I'm speeding and I get a ticket-- I am not going to automatically see the benefit to the consequence and be "happy" or at peace with it. I mean, if you get a speeding ticket, aren't you mad for awhile? Don't you need some time to come to terms with the mistake you made, accept that the consequence was a result, and move on?

I just wonder (I've just read snippets of SACH and have a friend who endorses it) how Tripp justifies that philosophy, and how/if anyone else here has responded to that logic?

Even my in-laws, who believe in spanking, don't expect a child to be happy about it afterward. They expect them to be upset (as they say, that's kind of the point of the spanking) and aren't trying to get them to be "sweet" afterward, they just have to stop whatever they were doing that caused the spanking.

This phrase/approach just really, really irks me because it adds a whole level of "faking it" and "acting happy" to the act of spanking that seems really damaging.

ETA: does Tripp justify it with something about God wanting a contrite heart? if so how could spanking cause the contrite heart-- if a kid knows they'll be spanked until they act contrite/sweet, then you'd quickly learn to "fake" that contriteness/sweetness, and it wouldn't be genuine at all, hence defeating the entire purpose right?

Elora · 07-28-2012, 02:09 PM

good christians rejoice in their suffering - it teaches perseverance, just ask paul. you deserve those beatings and much worse. be glad for them. if you're not, you probably just need to be punished for an incorrec t attitude.

staceylayne · 07-28-2012, 02:24 PM

My church led a men's study using SACH. I have a really hard time reconciling the authentic, kind and patient men I know from church and that kind of philosophy.

I mean, I was raised with ocassional spankings so I can wrap my mind around justifying that form of discipline when you're entrenched in the punitive dynamic. But expecting children to be "sweet" after a spanking?? (I actually detest that term for describing kids' attitude/behavior anyway.) :gag

forty-two · 07-28-2012, 02:30 PM

Tripp seems to justify it on grounds that God works on the heart *through* spanking

.

It's an article of faith for him - he believes that the Bible mandates spanking. Yet Tripp actually gets grace, to an extent, and so he has a rough time with the idea of a good God requiring parents to cause their little one pain, especially when other, gentler methods clearly work wrt outward compliance. So he's persuaded himself that God must work through spanking in a unique way - that spanking is how God works on the heart in kids who otherwise aren't cognitively capable of understanding the concept of sin (don't even get me started on the horribleness that is treating kids as "other"

, even to the point of claiming that God Himself cannot save them without their being properly cognitively aware

).

Anyway, so it's a "more cowbell" thing for Tripp - spanking works on the heart, so if the heart isn't right, God needs to work on it more. And spanking is how God does it

. Ergo, more spanking

.

LearningMama · 07-28-2012, 03:23 PM

That word sweet gives me the

Llee · 07-28-2012, 04:10 PM

There's your first failing. You want to approach it logically. :tsktsktsk That's not the way God works.

Zooey · 07-29-2012, 02:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by forty-two

Tripp seems to justify it on grounds that God works on the heart *through* spanking

.

It's an article of faith for him - he believes that the Bible mandates spanking. Yet Tripp actually gets grace, to an extent, and so he has a rough time with the idea of a good God requiring parents to cause their little one pain, especially when other, gentler methods clearly work wrt outward compliance. So he's persuaded himself that God must work through spanking in a unique way - that spanking is how God works on the heart in kids who otherwise aren't cognitively capable of understanding the concept of sin (don't even get me started on the horribleness that is treating kids as "other"

, even to the point of claiming that God Himself cannot save them without their being properly cognitively aware

).

Anyway, so it's a "more cowbell" thing for Tripp - spanking works on the heart, so if the heart isn't right, God needs to work on it more. And spanking is how God does it

. Ergo, more spanking

.

What Forty-Two said.

Quote:

Originally Posted by LearningMama

That word sweet gives me the

Yeah, me too.
That and

.

07-28-2012, 01:47 PM	#1
KSL Rose Bouquet Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 880	Spank them until they're sweet? I believe this comes from SACH by Ted Tripp, correct? for some reason I was thinking about this phrase ad concept before I went to bed last night. It just seems like such a logically incorrect way to approach discipline. Even IF you believed in spanking, why would you expect your kids, at age 2, 4, 6, whatever, to be "sweet" after you'd done it? Even for a natural consequence that comes with an action I do-- say, I'm speeding and I get a ticket-- I am not going to automatically see the benefit to the consequence and be "happy" or at peace with it. I mean, if you get a speeding ticket, aren't you mad for awhile? Don't you need some time to come to terms with the mistake you made, accept that the consequence was a result, and move on? I just wonder (I've just read snippets of SACH and have a friend who endorses it) how Tripp justifies that philosophy, and how/if anyone else here has responded to that logic? Even my in-laws, who believe in spanking, don't expect a child to be happy about it afterward. They expect them to be upset (as they say, that's kind of the point of the spanking) and aren't trying to get them to be "sweet" afterward, they just have to stop whatever they were doing that caused the spanking. This phrase/approach just really, really irks me because it adds a whole level of "faking it" and "acting happy" to the act of spanking that seems really damaging. ETA: does Tripp justify it with something about God wanting a contrite heart? if so how could spanking cause the contrite heart-- if a kid knows they'll be spanked until they act contrite/sweet, then you'd quickly learn to "fake" that contriteness/sweetness, and it wouldn't be genuine at all, hence defeating the entire purpose right? __________________ Kate Married to the Haitian Sensation since 2007 Mom to S, DS since October 2009 and E, DD born February 22nd, 2016 Last edited by KSL; 07-28-2012 at 01:49 PM.

07-28-2012, 02:09 PM	#2
Elora Deactivated Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 16,426	Re: Spank them until they're sweet? good christians rejoice in their suffering - it teaches perseverance, just ask paul. you deserve those beatings and much worse. be glad for them. if you're not, you probably just need to be punished for an incorrec t attitude.

07-28-2012, 02:24 PM	#3
staceylayne Rose Garden Hopeful. Join Date: May 2011 Location: Dallas (ish) Posts: 3,596	Re: Spank them until they're sweet? My church led a men's study using SACH. I have a really hard time reconciling the authentic, kind and patient men I know from church and that kind of philosophy. I mean, I was raised with ocassional spankings so I can wrap my mind around justifying that form of discipline when you're entrenched in the punitive dynamic. But expecting children to be "sweet" after a spanking?? (I actually detest that term for describing kids' attitude/behavior anyway.) :gag __________________ Married in 2003 to my favorite person in the wide world Joyful momma to: B - 7.5, my pensive planner D - 5.5, my spunky sunshine C - 3.5, my cuddly cutie And baby girl A, born April 28! Why, yes, I am ENFP But the wisdom from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, reasonable, full of mercy and good fruits, unwavering, without hypocrisy. And the seed whose fruit is righteousness is sown in peace by those who make peace. James 3:17-18

07-28-2012, 02:30 PM	#4
forty-two Rose Garden The Gospel is for Christians, too :). Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 6,911	Re: Spank them until they're sweet? Tripp seems to justify it on grounds that God works on the heart through spanking . It's an article of faith for him - he believes that the Bible mandates spanking. Yet Tripp actually gets grace, to an extent, and so he has a rough time with the idea of a good God requiring parents to cause their little one pain, especially when other, gentler methods clearly work wrt outward compliance. So he's persuaded himself that God must work through spanking in a unique way - that spanking is how God works on the heart in kids who otherwise aren't cognitively capable of understanding the concept of sin (don't even get me started on the horribleness that is treating kids as "other" , even to the point of claiming that God Himself cannot save them without their being properly cognitively aware ). Anyway, so it's a "more cowbell" thing for Tripp - spanking works on the heart, so if the heart isn't right, God needs to work on it more. And spanking is how God does it . Ergo, more spanking . __________________ ~ forty-two ~ Possessor of The Answer to Everything and Solver of (Somebody Else's) Problems INTJ: introverted iNtuition with extraverted Thinking DYT 4/2: connecting intellectually and emotionally Enneagram 5w4: a need to perceive and to feel special Wife to my pastor dh (INTP) since 2003 Mother to: dd13, 'R' dd10.5, 'A' ds8, 'J' and two in heaven: miscarried 10/29/04 and 01/01/05 Blog: Lutherama What we want is just one* thing, not the thing.*

07-28-2012, 03:23 PM	#5
LearningMama Rose Trellis Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Virginia Posts: 1,938	Re: Spank them until they're sweet? That word sweet gives me the __________________ Celeste INFJ Married to Marcus June 2009 Mama to "Little Bear" February 2011 Welcome Baby "YoYo" !! January 2014 Keeper of one grey cat Liz ...Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me. Matthew 25:40

07-28-2012, 04:10 PM	#6
Llee Moderator Dancing stands with all seahorses who are journeying to freedom Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 19,197	Re: Spank them until they're sweet? There's your first failing. You want to approach it logically. :tsktsktsk That's not the way God works. __________________ It's me, dh, Dressy Bessy (Sept 08) and Dancing Daisy (May 10) Lead the children to see in every pleasant and beautiful thing an expression of God's love for them. Recommend your religion to them by its pleasantness. Let the law of kindness be in your lips. ~Ellen G. White

X vBulletin 3.8.3 Debug Information
Page Generation 0.10102 seconds Memory Usage 7,837KB Queries Executed 16 (?)
More Information
Template Usage: (1)SHOWTHREAD (1)ad_footer_end (1)ad_footer_start (1)ad_header_end (1)ad_header_logo (1)ad_navbar_below (1)ad_showthread_beforeqr (1)ad_showthread_firstpost (1)ad_showthread_firstpost_sig (1)ad_showthread_firstpost_start (2)bbcode_quote (1)cyb_flashimagebanners (1)footer (1)forumjump (1)forumrules (1)gobutton (1)header (1)headinclude (1)navbar (3)navbar_link (60)option (7)post_groan_box (1)post_groan_javascript (1)post_groan_navbar_search (7)post_thanks_box (14)post_thanks_box_bit (1)post_thanks_javascript (1)post_thanks_navbar_search (5)post_thanks_postbit_legacy (7)postbit_legacy (7)postbit_onlinestatus (77)postbit_reputation (7)postbit_wrapper (4)showthread_bookmarksite (1)smqre_editor_button (1)spacer_close (1)spacer_open (1)tagbit_wrapper Phrase Groups Available: global inlinemod postbit posting reputationlevel showthread	Included Files: ./showthread.php ./global.php ./includes/init.php ./includes/class_core.php ./includes/config.php ./includes/functions.php ./includes/class_hook.php ./includes/functions_notice.php ./mobiquo/smartbanner.php ./mobiquo/include/classTTConnection.php ./mobiquo/smartbanner/head.inc.php ./includes/functions_bigthree.php ./includes/class_postbit.php ./includes/class_bbcode.php ./includes/functions_reputation.php ./includes/adminfunctions_template.php ./includes/functions_misc.php ./includes/functions_post_thanks.php ./includes/functions_post_groan.php Hooks Called: init_startup cache_permissions fetch_threadinfo_query fetch_threadinfo fetch_foruminfo style_fetch cache_templates global_start parse_templates fetch_musername notices_check_start global_setup_complete showthread_start template_groups template_safe_functions template_compile showthread_getinfo forumjump showthread_post_start showthread_query_postids showthread_query bbcode_fetch_tags bbcode_create showthread_postbit_create postbit_factory postbit_display_start post_thanks_function_post_thanks_off_start post_thanks_function_post_thanks_off_end post_thanks_function_fetch_thanks_start post_thanks_function_fetch_thanks_end post_thanks_function_thanked_already_start post_thanks_function_thanked_already_end post_groan_function_post_groan_off_start post_groan_function_post_groan_off_end post_groan_function_fetch_groans_start post_groan_function_fetch_groans_end post_groan_function_groaned_already_start post_groan_function_groaned_already_end reputation_image bbcode_parse_start postbit_imicons bbcode_parse_complete_precache bbcode_parse_complete postbit_display_complete error_fetch post_thanks_function_fetch_thanks_bit_start post_thanks_function_show_thanks_date_start post_thanks_function_fetch_thanks_bit_end post_thanks_function_fetch_post_thanks_template_start post_thanks_function_fetch_post_thanks_template_end tag_fetchbit_complete forumrules showthread_bookmarkbit navbits navbits_complete showthread_complete
Messages: