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Unprepared for Parenting (Ezzos, Pearls, Etc.) *Public* Support and information for those affected by the Ezzos, the Pearls, and other punitive and adversarial methods of child-rearing.
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23. No posts harshly dissecting parenting moments of others since we desire to humbly cultivate a heart attitude of grace and not judgment towards other mamas. We all struggle at times as parents and have much to learn, and GCM's focus is to provide tools and information for each of us to parent more effectively. Posts voicing some frustration regarding choices made by others can be okay, but it needs to be within the overall context of seeking understanding or ideas for better responses in the future.

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Old 06-16-2011, 08:31 AM   #1
Virginia
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Default Spanking "works"

I come from a punitive background. Both Mom and Dad spanked all of us kids growing up. So, I'm not sure how to respond to this idea, as set forth by some of my punitive family members and friends, that "spanking works." I have heard from several people that they spank because it "works" and nothing else will "work" with certain types of kids with specific temperaments.



I'm not trying to argue with people or win them over I know when to pass the bean dip, thanks to you lovely ladies here But I do want to work out, mostly for myself, how to respond to such claims...I just don't know what to say.

Part of me thinks the operative word is "works," and I need to hear others' thoughts.
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Old 06-16-2011, 08:38 AM   #2
WanderingJuniper
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Default Re: Spanking "works"

"Lots of parenting tools work. I am looking for the tools that work best for my children."

You not telling them they are wrong whether you believe they are or not. You are affirming that you are parenting effectively as well in combination with the specific personalities of your own children.
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Old 06-16-2011, 08:38 AM   #3
allisonintx
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Default Re: Spanking "works"

Works for what, though?

Works to incite a fear response? Yes.
Works to gain compliance? Sometimes.
Works to deter children from disobedience? Nope.
Makes them learn to hide their disobedience better? You betcha.

Works to build the relationship and trust that allows for discipleship? Nope.
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Old 06-16-2011, 08:41 AM   #4
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Default Re: Spanking "works"

depends on what they mean by "works"

does it stop the behavior? eventually. So does GOYB.

To me the biggest problems with spanking aren't whether or not it "works" but the following: (quick thoughts off the top of my head)

It's lazy parenting. It's easy to just spank at eveything rather than actually problem solve.

It drives a wedge b/w the parent and child. The child isn't going to trust the adult as much b/c they will always be worried about getting a spanking. Any of the PP/GBD/GOYB parenting styles help prevent this b/c they take away punishment.

It doesn't show God to our kids. In spite what people like to say, God does NOT spank us when we misbehave. Natural consequences (which God is pretty expert at) is not the same as spanking.

Spanking drives the kids "underground". The sneakiest kids I've ever known were always spanked.

Spanking does not provide a better alternative to the child for the misbehavior.

It makes the parent feel good and like they are doing "something" so it sets up a false sense of "works". It also leaves no option when it isn't working except to spank harder, more often or for more things.

Finally, people who think it works are going to see that it works b/c that is what they expect, kwim?

---------- Post added at 09:41 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:40 AM ----------

or what Allison said better and more consicely.
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Old 06-16-2011, 09:06 AM   #5
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Default Re: Spanking "works"

Let's not talk about spanking.
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Old 06-16-2011, 09:49 AM   #6
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Default Re: Spanking "works"

Of course spanking works.

Everybody knows that pain and the threat of pain change behaviour (to the degree that it is possible for a person to change it).

That's what works in abusive situations. It also worked in consentration camps. It works on animals. I wouldn't be surprised if if worked on worms or ameboeas.

It would be plum-stupid to claim that spanking doesn't work on children (within the limits of development).

Do you know what else "works" in human relationships? Extortion, bribery, captivity, enslavement, blackmail, theft, deception, manipulation, intoxication, propoganda, hypnosis (maybe not), isolation -- personal violence is not the only thing that "works" but isn't right.

The reason we avoid doing these things to other people is not because they wouldn't work... we avoid doing them because they are morally wrong. Lots of morally-wrong tactics "work" just fine. Many of them "work" really, really well. But we just don't do those things, because it's wrong to treat people that way.

I'm getting used to this space of the logic of:
If A: It's wrong to hit people...
And B: Children are people...
Therefore: It's wrong to hit children.

If that's true, it doesn't matter in the slightest if it "works".
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Old 06-16-2011, 10:08 AM   #7
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Default Re: Spanking "works"

I wouldn't get into it with them, but spanking didn't "work" for me and my parents didn't know that it didn't work for me until I told them when I was 26 years old So really... how do they know it "works" unless what they mean is "stops visible undesirable behavior?" Sure, I seemed to be better behaved. When my parents were there and I knew I couldn't "get away" with misbehaving My heart was still rebellious and being spanked just made me about as furious as a person can ever be!
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Old 06-16-2011, 10:23 AM   #8
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Default Re: Spanking "works"

I'm not interested in good behavior as much as I am good relationships. Spanking doesn't work for that.
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Old 06-16-2011, 11:05 AM   #9
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Default Re: Spanking "works"

Very wise words so far so I'll just add my story:

I was spanked and it "worked" to get me to obey but really all I learned was that if I could get away with something I avoided the punishment. I got really good at becoming the person my parents wanted me to be on the outside and rebelled on the inside.

And it ruined my relationship with my parents. How could I trust someone that hit me? I never really respected my parents, I pretended. I do not have a good relationship with my parents but if you asked them they would think it was fine

My son respects me because I respected him first
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Old 06-16-2011, 12:26 PM   #10
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Default Re: Spanking "works"

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Old 06-16-2011, 01:45 PM   #11
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Default Re: Spanking "works"

:subbing
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Old 06-16-2011, 01:58 PM   #12
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Default Re: Spanking "works"

Are you wondering inside yourself why (or whether) spanking doesn't work? If you are convicted, is it a question of how to articulte your beliefs? I think it matters who you're talking to. With my own mother, I've learned to be diplomatic to preserve that cherished (but very emotionally loaded) relationship.

With other friends or relatives? If they are lucky I will pass them bean dip. Or I might read them the riot act and not shut up until the room is cleared. I have very strong feelings and get provoked quickly. But my most succinct response to any spanking discussion is, "if only I could spank without hitting my kids!"
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Old 06-16-2011, 02:08 PM   #13
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Default Re: Spanking "works"

Quote:
Originally Posted by raisa View Post
, "if only I could spank without hitting my kids!"
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Old 06-16-2011, 03:16 PM   #14
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Default Re: Spanking "works"

Quote:
Originally Posted by raisa View Post
Are you wondering inside yourself why (or whether) spanking doesn't work? If you are convicted, is it a question of how to articulte your beliefs? I think it matters who you're talking to. With my own mother, I've learned to be diplomatic to preserve that cherished (but very emotionally loaded) relationship.

With other friends or relatives? If they are lucky I will pass them bean dip. Or I might read them the riot act and not shut up until the room is cleared. I have very strong feelings and get provoked quickly. But my most succinct response to any spanking discussion is, "if only I could spank without hitting my kids!"
When I was "confronted" on Facebook about my recent blog post regarding gentle discipline (it was a "coming out" of sorts for me), I realized that I hadn't worked out within myself exactly why spanking "doesn't work" and therefore couldn't articulate it when I wanted to.

One person I want to be able to articulate to is DH. He was spanked growing up but has pretty good relationships with his parents
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Old 06-16-2011, 03:29 PM   #15
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Default Re: Spanking "works"

Just because something is effective does not mean it is also appropriate.
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