What does Pearl actually teach?

[mountainash]

Originally Posted by Taedareth

That's what I don't understand I know two mamas who have read Pearl's book and they seem like nice parents. why would they like what he has to say?

I read the book when my son was a few months old. I also received their magazine probably up until my son was two. It might be helpful to understand that I came from a very legalistic background (exclusive brethrenism) and the god of shame, fear, punishment, manipulation, disappointment, retaliation, and pain ruled my life.

I liked how the families who followed the Pearls seemed to have it all together--and the ones who followed him and didn't have it all together, well, I figured surely they just weren't doing it right.

I didn't know what Grace looked like in the context of parenting a young child. I also didn't have a clue what setting healthy boundaries looked like. More than I realized at the time, I viewed my son as an adversary who needed to be kept under control. To me, he represented the epitome of self-centeredness and I was convinced it was my job to break him of that.

I was absolutely terrified that my children would be corrupted if I didn't show them I was the boss right from the very start. I clearly remember thinking, "How do I reason with a ten-month-old without causing pain? How can I get a child that young to comply with my requests? How can I convince a baby that I must be obeyed." It seems so ridiculous now. I mean, you get off your butt--obviously! If the baby is going for the computer cords--get up, pick up the baby, move the cords or don't allow baby in the office. DUH!! But back then it didn't occur to me. I just thought I needed to show him that he could get hurt playing with the computer cords by hurting him for playing with the computer cords.

Thank God my husband insisted we not hit or spank. He's the only person I would have submitted to on that front. His gentle insistence forced me to find gentle ways to respond to my son and soon I realized that there were better ways.

Thank God my son has a corn allergy--I wouldn't have found MDC or GCM if I hadn't been looking to these sites for tips on how to avoid corn.

Grace got through to me sometime around December of 2007. After that, I began to see God as a gentle Father and parenting otherwise seemed absurd.

[hopeforchange]

Originally Posted by mountainash

I was absolutely terrified that my children would be corrupted if I didn't show them I was the boss right from the very start. I clearly remember thinking, "How do I reason with a ten-month-old without causing pain? How can I get a child that young to comply with my requests? How can I convince a baby that I must be obeyed."

i remember thinking that about the daycare kids i watched. i thought, "how can they understand what 'no' means without being spanked?" sadly enough, the ppl i went to church with, at the time, were encouraging me to find ways to "discipline" the babies that the cameras wouldn't see, like pinching them under their arms when i went to pick them up. these were babies in the infant room! at least i was smart enough to realize that i couldn't do things like that to kids that weren't mine.

i am so glad i found GCM before my dd got old enough to "discipline".

[amyhntr2]

Originally Posted by hopeforchange

sadly enough, the ppl i went to church with, at the time, were encouraging me to find ways to "discipline" the babies that the cameras wouldn't see, like pinching them under their arms when i went to pick them up. these were babies in the infant room!

that is heartbreaking!

[jewelmcjem]

I think, for me, the bottom line argument for anyone I would talk to about it is that the Pearls teach that the reason for spanking your child is to make them presentable to God. I don't know of *anyone* IRL who spanks who would believe that, whether or not they believe that the Bible says to spank.

I have just learned that here, I don't have a quote specifically to that. I just know I've read it recently, I believe it was AOL who said it just that way.

[relizabeth]

I wouldn't even call what the Pearls teach "spanking".

Sensitive.

IMO, a methodology that involves "switching" a child's feet if they go outside without their shoes, or the child's feet and ankles if they put their shoes on backward, without a word, just walk up and start hitting the feet and ankles until the child puts on the shoes the right way, is not spanking as it's defined in the church now. For the Pearls, apparently, a switch is worth a thousand words. YUCK.

[tofufoofoo]

As a new mom I get very defensive and weary about my choices. I want to know what the Pearls actually teach because what I have heard just sounds too wild to be true! However, I agree with the PP and feel like my insecurities about my mothering make me very vulnerable to attack. It is interesting that some mamas feel satan can attack unsure mamas through books like these. I would have said it but felt crazy. Thank you for letting me know I'm not alone! Thanks for this thread it reminded me why I need to stay away from "experts" like the Pearls and etc.

---------- Post added at 02:40 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:36 PM ----------

Originally Posted by hopeforchange

i remember thinking that about the daycare kids i watched. i thought, "how can they understand what 'no' means without being spanked?" sadly enough, the ppl i went to church with, at the time, were encouraging me to find ways to "discipline" the babies that the cameras wouldn't see, like pinching them under their arms when i went to pick them up. these were babies in the infant room! at least i was smart enough to realize that i couldn't do things like that to kids that weren't mine.

i am so glad i found GCM before my dd got old enough to "discipline".

I am terrified to leave DD in the church nursery and now I know why

[Sparrow]

Originally Posted by DoulaClara

I
Be careful with reading. I know I've said this a lot recently, but when I started reading what they actually write (shortly after Gianna was born), it messed me up a lot, emotionally. Like, it affected my marriage, the way I interacted with a family member who seems to like the Pearls, etc. It was BAD. It's pure evil. I know another mom on these boards gave the book a shot a short while ago, and she had a similar visceral reaction. Make sure your faith is rock-solid, make sure you are surrounding yourself with people who can re-orient you spiritually and emotionally, and know when to put it down, whether you borrow it or read it or somehow come into contact with it somehow. I read it while it was still online, and that was still bad enough.

I really, really second this. I feel like there is some pretty gross spiritual stuff that goes with reading this book. For me (it may be different for you) just reading the excerpts messed me up. For me, it was up there with reading about demonic encounters and ghost stories, etc. I believe Pearl is just a little puppet for Satan.

[brandi]

Originally Posted by mamaBear

I really, really second this. I feel like there is some pretty gross spiritual stuff that goes with reading this book. For me (it may be different for you) just reading the excerpts messed me up. For me, it was up there with reading about demonic encounters and ghost stories, etc. I believe Pearl is just a little puppet for Satan.

Exactlty

[NewLeaf]

Originally Posted by hopeforchange

the ppl i went to church with, at the time, were encouraging me to find ways to "discipline" the babies that the cameras wouldn't see, like pinching them under their arms when i went to pick them up. these were babies in the infant room!

That is so disturbing!

[SortaCrunchy]

Originally Posted by DoulaClara

It's a 1/4 inch type of tubing, used typically by plumbers, but it's probably a multi-use thing (although God knows it was never meant to be used on children). I don't think that it's called "plumbing line" officially, but I think most people who run to Lowes to buy it can ask for that and usually get aimed in the direction of the PVC tubing.

Be careful with reading. I know I've said this a lot recently, but when I started reading what they actually write (shortly after Gianna was born), it messed me up a lot, emotionally. Like, it affected my marriage, the way I interacted with a family member who seems to like the Pearls, etc. It was BAD. I wanted to get a primary source for my arguments against them, and it really shook me to the core- the Pearls are, I firmly believe, being used as a tool of Satan himself. My family member in law keeps trying to get DH to agree to take a copy of the book to at least look at it and decide for himself, but I've set the firm boundary that if the book ever shows up in my house at all for any reason, it's going in the fireplace with a hefty soaking of fuel and as many matches that I can throw at it. It's pure evil. I know another mom on these boards gave the book a shot a short while ago, and she had a similar visceral reaction. Make sure your faith is rock-solid, make sure you are surrounding yourself with people who can re-orient you spiritually and emotionally, and know when to put it down, whether you borrow it or read it or somehow come into contact with it somehow. I read it while it was still online, and that was still bad enough.

Thank you for continuing to speak to this. I still have my copy of BW which I reference often in discussions on it, but for some reason, I just CANNOT CANNOT CANNOT read Pearl material. I feel strongly it is the Holy Spirit sending up big caution flags for me. Maybe some day, years from now, I *might* be able to read it. I can barely handle reading excerpts at this point.

Thank you for loving us enough, sister, to continue to warn us about it.

[Cherish]

I'm really struggling, because even the excerpts have been "doing violence" to my mind. I posted some excerpts on my fb page and was very disturbed that at the response from older, "godly" people that I got. I've felt sickened by it, but what's worse, when I got frustrated the other day with some squabbling, the temptation to "parent by punishing" rose up out of nowhere and really shocked me! I have no doubt that it's from just the excerpts I've read of MP. I've been praying/thinking about it, and I have to agree that there is a very strong demonic "impartation" that comes with reading anything from these people. (thankfully I know how to get my "brain washed" the right way and get that junk out of my head!) It's disturbing to me because I'd consider myself VERY well grounded in the Word and in my understanding of Grace in parenting, it's truly one of our core values.
I'm starting to wonder... is it really so far out of the ball park to look at every "pearl parent" as a potential child abuser and watch for signs of that in their children, and be ready to report them to the authorities if necessary? What do you all think?

[NewLeaf]

Originally Posted by Cherish

I'm starting to wonder... is it really so far out of the ball park to look at every "pearl parent" as a potential child abuser and watch for signs of that in their children, and be ready to report them to the authorities if necessary? What do you all think?

I don't think that would be unwise at all. I think it would be a good thing. These people's values and discernment are way off. It is a recipe for disaster. I don't think it means vilifying them or harassing them, but keeping your radar up is a good thing. Praying for them is a great thing.

[Taedareth]

Originally Posted by Cherish

I'm starting to wonder... is it really so far out of the ball park to look at every "pearl parent" as a potential child abuser and watch for signs of that in their children, and be ready to report them to the authorities if necessary? What do you all think?

I'm really glad you asked this question. I have been in a moms' book study group (we read Christian books like Having a Mary Heart in a Martha World etc.). One of the moms in this group thinks Pearl is wonderful. Recently she shared a story of how her 2-3 yo (not sure of his age) found a pair of scissors and explored the house with them She laughed when she told us that he "got the whipping of his life." Another mom in the group (friend of the first woman) has a 1-2 yo toddler and says she hits him with something she refers to as "the spanker" and in response to my comment that spanking is not actually an effective form of discipline in the long run, she claims that in her experience it is very effective.

I just feel nauseated and distressed by this, to the point where I don't even want to be around them. Thankfully their attendance is only sporadic, and the core mamas in this group don't seem to be that way. But I'm not sure what to do. I don't feel that God has given me the go-ahead to do what I *want* to do and preach at the Pearl-mamas And I don't think He's said I should leave the group, which is good because normally it's a source of excellent fellowship for me and my homeschooled kids. But I do really stress myself out when I think about having the Pearl parents around, and how much I want to rush in there and change them

Last time I posted a thread on this forum asking about whether I should talk to the Pearl moms, people here just said that in their experience it's totally ineffective to even try Is praying for them the only thing we can/should do??

[Sparrow]

Originally Posted by Taedareth

has a 1-2 yo toddler and says she hits him with something she refers to as "the spanker" and in response to my comment that spanking is not actually an effective form of discipline in the long run, she claims that in her experience it is very effective.

Effective and stopping the behaviour in its tracks, yes. Effective maybe because baby doesn't have a persistent personality. I was spanked. On the outside it was effective because I didn't appear to misbehave. But I was angry inside, and I did do things that were not right. I just made sure I didn't get caught. So, I was deceptive. It put distance between me and my mom, she was a very angry spanker. And not just a spanker, but at a hitter - if we were to define it the way that spankers define spanking. I came out of childhood with the appearance of a good child, but I was a seething angry mess.

This is always my answer when I am told that spanking is effective. As bad as it sounds, I would rather my child learn through natural consequences than do damage to our relationship.

---------- Post added at 03:08 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:04 PM ----------

Originally Posted by Taedareth

Is praying for them the only thing we can/should do??

I haven't met any Pearl followers, just Dobson and Ezzos. I pray for them. I'd pray for opportunities to talk about it when defenses weren't up, pray for God to soften hearts, and to speak to their hearts. I really believe this stuff has a spiritual stronghold and I think praying for protection is a good idea.

Everything about Pearl is wrong, from his parenting to the type of partner his wife thinks she should be.

[Cherish]

wondering if we should make a spin off thread? Not sure what the criteria is for that? I think there must be more proactive things we can do. I wonder if it became widespread to REPORT Pearl parents as potential abusers (to me, someone saying they were giving a 2 year old the whipping of his life is more than enough for me to report), it would make a difference? Or would it only entrench them further?