more rod discussions

[ArmsOfLove]

1 Corinthians 4:21 "What will ye? shall I come unto you with a rod, or in love, and [in] the spirit of meekness? "

"rod" Greek=rhabdos

1) a staff, a walking stick, a twig, rod, branch

2) a rod with which one is beaten

3) a staff

a) as used on a journey, or to lean upon, or by shepherds

b) when applied to kings

1) with a rod of iron, indicates the severest, most rigorous rule

2) a royal sceptre

Proverbs 29:15 "The rod and reproof give wisdom: but a child left [to himself] bringeth his mother to shame. "

rod Hebrew=shebet

1) rod, staff, branch, offshoot, club, sceptre, tribe

a) rod, staff

b) shaft (of spear, dart)

c) club (of shepherd's implement)

d) truncheon, sceptre (mark of authority)

e) clan, tribe

Isaiah 10:26 "And the LORD of hosts shall stir up a scourge for him according to the slaughter of Midian at the rock of Oreb: and [as] his rod [was] upon the sea, so shall he lift it up after the manner of Egypt. "

matteh

1) staff, branch, tribe

a) staff, rod, shaft

b) branch (of vine)

c) tribe

1) company led by chief with staff (originally)

"choter" is a third Hebrew word and I can't find the verse that uses it off hand but it's the one that means "twig".

[heartofjoy]

rod Greek=shebet

I thought shebet was Hebrew. Is this a typo Crystal?

[hsgbdmama]

FWIW, I just wanted to post where I received the information regarding Mr. Pearl. It is from Created To Be His Help Meet by Debi Pearl (No Greater Joy Ministries), and here is the reference:

My husband started studying Greek forty years ago. (He daily uses three different Greek Bibles in order to correct the teachers who attempt to correct the Bible with the Greek.) When my husband, who is a Bible scholar and, for many years, also a student of Greek, wants to know what God says, he always opens his KJV Bible.

(Pearl, 53)

[ArmsOfLove]

Originally Posted by heartofjoy

I thought shebet was Hebrew. Is this a typo Crystal?

Yes I had fussy babies on me :P

[ArmsOfLove]

I think someone should let Mr. Pearl know that the authors of the Bible are all Jewish (except for one who may have been a Gentile God-fearer but may actually have been Jewish after all) and that even when writing in Greek they were expressing a Hebraic mindset!

[hsgbdmama]

Originally Posted by ArmsOfLove

I think someone should let Mr. Pearl know that the authors of the Bible are all Jewish (except for one who may have been a Gentile God-fearer but may actually have been Jewish after all) and that even when writing in Greek they were expressing a Hebraic mindset!

That's kind of what I thought ... wasn't the OT primarily written in Hebrew and the NT primarily in Greek (and Aramaic)? (At least this is what I remember from Bethel Bible. )

And why THREE Greek Bibles? Is there a difference in translations? Thanks for answering my questions.

[ArmsOfLove]

Well the Pentateuch was the Greek version of the Hebrew Scriptures and that is, if I am getting the order correctly, what the Latin Vulgate was translated from and that is what the KJV is from. So if he's KJV only he would probably consider the Pentateuch the most reliable because that's what the KJV comes from--but that is still a translation

[hsgbdmama]

Huh. Interesting -- thanks, Crystal!

[mummy2boys]

How silly! So because someone disagrees with you on women pastors the rest of what they say is useless? She must get her info from a very narrow world. Almost every denomination has women pastors nowadays.

Unfortunately this is what disturbs me most...that just because someone doesn't agree with women being ordained or preaching (sorry Crystal....but I have to be honest here ) and I don't, that you would dismiss what I think?????


Weird

[greenemama]

okay, so here's some more from the same blog in the OP. i am so horrified to be told that i HATE my children because i do not literally hit them with a rod. i am so sad that people believe this junk!

she's taking this from the matthew henry commentary.

Pro 13:24 He that spareth his rod hateth his son: but he that loveth him chasteneth him betimes.
"Note, 1. To the education of children in that which is good there is necessary a due correction of them for what is amiss; every child of ours is a child of Adam, and therefore has that foolishness bound up in his heart which calls for rebuke, more or less, the rod and reproof which give wisdom. Observe, It is his rod that must be used, the rod of a parent, directed by wisdom and love, and designed for good, not the rod of a servant. 2. It is good to begin betimes (early) with the necessary restraints of children from that which is evil, before vicious habits are confirmed. The branch is easily bent when it is tender. 3. Those really hate their children, though they pretend to be fond of them, that do not keep them under a strict discipline, and by all proper methods, severe ones when gentle ones will not serve, make them sensible of their faults and afraid of offending. They abandon them to their worst enemy, to the most dangerous disease, and therefore hate them. Let this reconcile children to the correction their good parents give them; it is from love, and for their good, Heb. 12:7-9."

Please note:
1. M. Henry believed that foolishness was bound up in the heart even of children of believers and that correction of such included physical punishment.
2. It is to be administered by the parents, not a servant (teacher or principal?).
3. It is good to begin early in childhood, not wait until adolescence when the corruption is ingrained.
4. Those who refuse to use physical punishment when it is warranted, really hate their children, "though they pretend to be fond of them."
5. One of the purposes of strict discipline is to make the child "afraid of offending."

any comments here? i feel so depressed after reading it. i realize that this is a typical belief system and that my inlaws most likely believe this way. i'm forever gathering information and looking for places to study the thing so that if (when?) the subject comes up i can be prepared in case i run out of bean dip.

[ArmsOfLove]

Reading commentaries is not the same as exegetical study of the Scriptures I wouldn't even bother responding to that.

[greenemama]

i'm not planning on responding to her at all again. she called us all "scripture twisters" and "liberal" and indicated that she believes that i am merely "professing" christianity as i don't spank. there's no way i'm responding to someone who cannot dialogue without namecalling.

i guess i'm wondering what your comments are on the commentary. it sounds like something my IL would say. :/

[ArmsOfLove]

Well, I don't disagree with it if you read the "rod" as "authority" and "the Word of God". Insert these meanings and his commentary is fine

severe ones when gentle ones will not serve, make them sensible of their faults and afraid of offending

I'm no Bible scholar, but I don't like this part of Henry's wording.... :/

I don't like the notion that we are supposed to instill fear in our children--at least not fear of US or fear of offending men. I realize he's from a different time and uses the English language in a slightly different way, but I think she's interpreting it quite literally.. they should be AFRAID.

And if your inlaws or someone IRL brings it up, you can always respond with what Crystal said:

Reading commentaries is not the same as exegetical study of the Scriptures

[chelsea]

4. Those who refuse to use physical punishment when it is warranted, really hate their children, "though they pretend to be fond of them."

Umm, yah...I'm only pretending to be fond of my son.
He really couldn't get much more judgemental than that.
Hmm, or could we say that his comment is true AND that physical punishment is never warranted, therefore we are really never "refusing to use physical punishment when it is warranted" because it is never warranted???