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Unprepared for Parenting (Ezzos, Pearls, Etc.) *Public* Support and information for those affected by the Ezzos, the Pearls, and other punitive and adversarial methods of child-rearing.
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23. No posts harshly dissecting parenting moments of others since we desire to humbly cultivate a heart attitude of grace and not judgment towards other mamas. We all struggle at times as parents and have much to learn, and GCM's focus is to provide tools and information for each of us to parent more effectively. Posts voicing some frustration regarding choices made by others can be okay, but it needs to be within the overall context of seeking understanding or ideas for better responses in the future.

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Old 04-14-2012, 10:32 AM   #61
Can'tTurnLeft
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Default Re: Above Rubies and failed adoptions

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Originally Posted by Elibellamiah View Post

Thank you for saying that. I don't know if it will ever happen, but I've thought a lot for many years about adopting or foster parenting someday. I think there are a lot of reasons behind why I would do it, but recently I was on a foster parenting board to learn more about it and at some point felt really attacked and like people thought I was just doing it for selfish reasons. It was after I asked if most people want babies, because if I fostered I think I would like to foster babies but I have the impression everyone wants babies. Is the fact that I would like to care for more babies selfish? So I wondered a lot after that, is there a not selfish reason to foster or adopt? Most people do so because they want children. Is it better to do so just because you want to help someone? It's not like my focus would be on fulfilling my own desire, I just think there are babies who need to be taken care of and even though this is probably my last pregnancy, I don't feel ready to be done taking care of babies. Or if I adopted, I would really like another daughter and I would like my daughter to have a sister. Is that wrong? Should I be more focused on just wanting to help a child in need? I don't know if this makes any sense, it's just part of where I was coming from with that.
I think for a lot of people there is a "selfish" element to wanting to adopt. I wanted to be a mom. My body wasn't cooperating. So I adopted. It was about *me* in a lot of ways. Our children were both newborns when we adopted them. We were in the delivery room both times. They weren't in "need" per se. It wasn't about that. I'm not going to go into more of their story on a public board, but I will say this. The FAR vast majority of infants who are placed by their parents voluntarily are not in "need" in the traditional sense, and never would have been. That doesn't mean their parents don't have valid and important reasons for placing them, but they weren't in "need" because they were true orphans, or removed from their families because of severe abuse.

Everybody needs to pray about their adoptions, and what they want them to look like. Wanting to raise more babies is a fine reason to want to adopt, but it is vital, no matter what path you choose, to be as educated on ethics as possible. You can't approach adoption from the point of view of wanting to save a child, or rescue a child. Sometimes there is an element of adoption in that, but to move entirely from that motivation is dangerous. It leads to children being put in the position of needing to be "grateful" No child should be made to feel grateful that they were adopted. If they choose that feeling, that is one thing, but when parents go into it with the express purpose of rescuing a child, that sets up a bad dynamic.
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Old 04-14-2012, 11:43 AM   #62
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Default Re: Above Rubies and failed adoptions

!!!!!!!!!!! What? Why are they are allowed to do that? What bothers me is the idea of hurting these children for life. They've had enough trauma and don't need more! Those poor cubs!
I would like to be a foster parent. I've done some research on older child adoption and I am not sure if I am mature enough for it because those poor kids will act out and if folks can't have the patience and compassion to deal with them without pain and extreme punishment... urg. It will make it so much worse for them. Adopting because you want to save them is a horrible idea. These kids must be your family and you must be ready to respond to their acting out with love and compassion!






Quote:
Originally Posted by Can'tTurnLeft View Post
What you described in your post is one of the reasons why so many of us adoptive families balk at the idea of adoption being a "good deed" I don't know anybody personally who adopted with the purpose of doing a "good deed" We adopted to grow our families.

---------- Post added at 12:39 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:33 PM ----------



To bring people to Jesus. Nancy Campbell is part of the extreme quiverfull and wife only submission movement. It is a fairly common teaching among those people that adopted children have to do a penance of sorts for the generational sins that landed them with the need to be adopted. Extra spankings, extra service, etc... It is, according to these people, a way to attain salvation for them.
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Old 04-14-2012, 01:15 PM   #63
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Default Re: Above Rubies and failed adoptions

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Originally Posted by Stiina View Post
This is interesting! I read the other thread now as well - thanks ManaLinda for the link

I think there are definitely good things that Sally and Nancy do, and they seem like very nice ladies...I guess you'd just have to be able to weed through the yuck in order to get to the good. But knowing their stance on this now, for *me*, I don't think it's worth it to weed through the yuck. I've got GCM

She does seem like she's very earnest and following God in the way she believes it. So you're probably right...and what I said about her having motives was probably not fair But ... didn't she read the part in the Bible that said, ya know, that things we do (or their adopted kids do) don't earn you salvation??

I think it's important to point out that Sally Clarkson is not anything like Nancy or Above Rubies. Instead, she's an example of graceful mothering.
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Old 04-14-2012, 01:57 PM   #64
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Default Re: Above Rubies and failed adoptions

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Originally Posted by Stiina View Post


i got a couple of magazines after some encouragement from some really respected friends...and then asked for my subsription to be stopped. It was just too *weird*...I didn't really know what was off about it. then I read on gcm about sally clarkson and I think I understand a little bit now.

i just wonder what her motives are...?
To raise a bigger army than the Muslims. Seriously, I heard her say it.
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Old 04-14-2012, 02:17 PM   #65
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Default Re: Above Rubies and failed adoptions

Yeah, our last church said the same thing, and was pushing QF mentality.
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Old 04-14-2012, 03:33 PM   #66
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Default Re: Above Rubies and failed adoptions

How dumb. You can't build a strong army if you are doing some of the same stuff they are doing. EI, Reducing women to ONLY having tons of babies, tormenting said babies with soul destroying hitting, women not having an equal education to men. What are they THINKING? It doesn't seem like a healthy mentality at all...
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Old 04-14-2012, 04:07 PM   #67
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Default Re: Above Rubies and failed adoptions

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Originally Posted by SilverMoon View Post
I think it's important to point out that Sally Clarkson is not anything like Nancy or Above Rubies. Instead, she's an example of graceful mothering.

I guess I don't really know the difference between them. Sorry for lumping them together!
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Old 04-14-2012, 04:30 PM   #68
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Default Re: Above Rubies and failed adoptions

Sally Clarkson is wonderful. Her blog is www.itakejoy.com. She has some amazing books out on mothering such as The Ministry Of Motherhood and The Mission of Motherhood. Definitely check her out.
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Old 04-16-2012, 03:17 AM   #69
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Default Re: Above Rubies and failed adoptions

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How dumb. You can't build a strong army if you are doing some of the same stuff they are doing. EI, Reducing women to ONLY having tons of babies, tormenting said babies with soul destroying hitting, women not having an equal education to men. What are they THINKING? It doesn't seem like a healthy mentality at all...
And that is exactly what I said without the colorful sailor wording when I kept having that mentality shoved onto me as "the way" that all "biblical women" should be.

It isn't healthy.
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Old 04-23-2012, 01:52 PM   #70
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Default Re: Above Rubies and failed adoptions

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The family my family know of who went through the adoption process, they had the child from a newborn (or close to newborn) and it took two years. He was a Magistrate, she was a primary teacher. Their own two children who were 7 and 11 i *think* at the time, were both grilled for an hour each (and seperately) by social services about their faith and why they believed what they did, and their parents werent allowed in with them . And that family were a professional family. DH and i arent, so it would be even more difficult for us if we were to do it. And tbh, it really puts me off.
I'm not comfortable going into details on so public a forum, but I know (to varying extents) several Christian families who have fostered (or are still fostering), adopted from the UK care system and also from China. They are not all "professionals". I haven't discussed the details with them but I know that they would normally talk to older children about their attitude to their family fostering/adopting and I wonder if it was as a result of those kids saying that their family wanted to adopt because of their faith that led to much of the interview being about their faith? I have to admit also to curiosity (which you should feel under no compulsion to satisfy) as to how they adopted a baby in the UK when they already had children unless it was a private adoption. (For US readers who don't realise, there are not many babies available here and it's extremely rare for birth parents to choose who adopts their child - it's a totally different system in that respect).
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