Pearl's "plant your tree in the midst of the garden"

TuneMyHeart · 01-30-2010, 07:18 PM

I read the first chapter of TTUAC today and I'm really hoping he's taking this verse out of context:

Quote:

When God wanted to "train" his first two children not to touch, He did not place the forbidden object out of their reach. Instead, He placed the "tree of knowledge of good and evil" in the "midst of the garden (Gen. 3:3)."

I wish I hadn't read this.

JessicaTX · 01-30-2010, 07:20 PM

Well, it didn't work out too well did it? If you take that view it seems like you'd have the view that God set us up to fail. I don't think that was the point of the tree in the garden.

BriansLovie · 01-30-2010, 07:26 PM

I so despise how he thinks that we must put temptation in front of our children to train them. It seriously makes me ill.

TuneMyHeart · 01-30-2010, 07:28 PM

why did he put the tree in the garden? I definitely don't think He sets us up to fail, and I would never do that to my children.

01-30-2010, 07:29 PM

That's my question, as well. *Why* put the tree in the middle of the Garden? Why not put it were they couldn't get at it?

tigerlily · 01-30-2010, 07:31 PM

01-30-2010, 07:35 PM

So, with this reasoning, are we supposed to hire a hooker to try to seduce our teenage sons, just to see if they can withstand the temptation? Seriously?

Autumn · 01-30-2010, 07:44 PM

If obedience were our only option it wouldn't be obedience. He wanted us to choose to love him and obey him.

If I made a robot that I programmed to wake me up every morning with a warm cup of coffee and tell me how much it loves me, how wonderful I am and how beautiful I look today, it doesn't matter - it's a robot. It was programmed to do that and it's doing that because that's all it can do - it isn't genuine. It doesn't really love me because it's not choosing to love me, it doesn't have any other options.

God gave Adam and Eve only one thing that they couldn't do. If he hadn't given them the opportunity to potentially disobey, it wouldn't matter how much they obeyed - it wouldn't have been genuine.

I love the people I love because I have made a decision to love them. If I didn't have a choice, it wouldn't be real love.

THAT BEING SAID: The Pearls are taking this whole thing way out of context. That's extreme and not fitting with the inconceivable love God has for his children. He doesn't want us to fail - He wants us to really love Him.

tiffany · 01-30-2010, 07:59 PM

This is probably not going to be a popular opinion here, so I'm prepared for

Please hear me out on this and don't hit me just yet.

I don't think God put the tree there to temp us, but I do think there are things that are within our reach that he does not remove from our grasp that he teaches us to stay away from. For example, in the NT he says that gentiles are to abstain from blood. Blood is still in people, in animals, in our food, etc. He didn't do away with blood, just because we are not to mess with it. He just gives us the instruction to stay away from it. In the Torah, the command is given to abstain from unclean meat, but those animals are not wiped off the globe, we just have to stay away from them in our diet (if we are TO). He tells us not to look at another with lust, but He doesn't blind us. He tells us not to be sexually immoral, but He doesn't render us unable to do so - not by removing our physical abilities, our emotional abilities, or by removing the opposite sex from our interactions. All those things are still within our grasp, we are just instructed and taught not to go there.

I don't think it's healthy to remove any obstacle from out child's grasp and let them run 'willy nilly' - it's just not what God does with us. However, I don't agree with the idea that He put it there to tempt us either. There is a difference between doing something to tempt someone and teaching them not to get involved with something that is plainly there and that we have to learn to work around. Like dressing modestly. We are to be modest in our dress so as not to tempt other men, but we don't have to cut our breasts off so they don't show, ya know? There is balance. We have to be careful about working with the opposite sex. We need to keep things professional and not be one-on-one with a person of the opposite sex if we can help it, certainly not setting ourselves up for temptation, but women don't go work in environments where only other women work and vice versa. We just learn to navigate around it within godly limits. I think that's the hard part of parenting - finding the boundaries and teaching them to our children, so they will learn to apply boundaries to their own lives.

I have a friend who doesn't want to teach her children boundaries at all and there have been very uncomfortable situations with her children on many occasions. There has to be balance.

Self-control - that's part of the fruit of the spirit, and it has to be developed.

saturnfire16 · 02-03-2010, 07:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tiffany

This is probably not going to be a popular opinion here, so I'm prepared for

Please hear me out on this and don't hit me just yet.

I don't think God put the tree there to temp us, but I do think there are things that are within our reach that he does not remove from our grasp that he teaches us to stay away from. For example, in the NT he says that gentiles are to abstain from blood. Blood is still in people, in animals, in our food, etc. He didn't do away with blood, just because we are not to mess with it. He just gives us the instruction to stay away from it. In the Torah, the command is given to abstain from unclean meat, but those animals are not wiped off the globe, we just have to stay away from them in our diet (if we are TO). He tells us not to look at another with lust, but He doesn't blind us. He tells us not to be sexually immoral, but He doesn't render us unable to do so - not by removing our physical abilities, our emotional abilities, or by removing the opposite sex from our interactions. All those things are still within our grasp, we are just instructed and taught not to go there.

I don't think it's healthy to remove any obstacle from out child's grasp and let them run 'willy nilly' - it's just not what God does with us. However, I don't agree with the idea that He put it there to tempt us either. There is a difference between doing something to tempt someone and teaching them not to get involved with something that is plainly there and that we have to learn to work around. Like dressing modestly. We are to be modest in our dress so as not to tempt other men, but we don't have to cut our breasts off so they don't show, ya know? There is balance. We have to be careful about working with the opposite sex. We need to keep things professional and not be one-on-one with a person of the opposite sex if we can help it, certainly not setting ourselves up for temptation, but women don't go work in environments where only other women work and vice versa. We just learn to navigate around it within godly limits. I think that's the hard part of parenting - finding the boundaries and teaching them to our children, so they will learn to apply boundaries to their own lives.

I have a friend who doesn't want to teach her children boundaries at all and there have been very uncomfortable situations with her children on many occasions. There has to be balance.

Self-control - that's part of the fruit of the spirit, and it has to be developed.

To me, the big difference is that all the things you mentioned- unclean animals, blood, breasts, the opposite sex- ALL serve another purpose besides being an oppotunity to use the wrong way. They aren't *only* temptations. They have a purpose. The temptation is to use them in a way other than the way God designed them.

A trash can has a purpose and *also* MAY be a temptation for a child to get into. A trash can placed in the middle of the living room for the *sole purpose* of enticing a child to touch it and then hitting them is not the same thing.

tiffany · 02-04-2010, 08:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by saturnfire16

To me, the big difference is that all the things you mentioned- unclean animals, blood, breasts, the opposite sex- ALL serve another purpose besides being an oppotunity to use the wrong way. They aren't *only* temptations. They have a purpose. The temptation is to use them in a way other than the way God designed them.

A trash can has a purpose and *also* MAY be a temptation for a child to get into. A trash can placed in the middle of the living room for the *sole purpose* of enticing a child to touch it and then hitting them is not the same thing.

I agree with you!

I don't think God put it there to tempt them - I think it served another purpose. I don't know what, but I agree that He didn't just plant it, or as mentioned before allow it to be there, just for the sole purpose of temptation. I am NOT agreeing with the Pearl's on this - I think they are WAY off base and do twist scripture and have a sadistic view of God, themselves, and children. It's sad.

I'm just saying I don't think that we should remove every thing out of our children's path because God didn't remove everything from our path, even if it is tempting. I am not saying *put* something there for the sole purpose of tempting.

mwwr · 02-20-2010, 07:03 PM

bbl

breezy · 02-18-2010, 09:37 PM

oh dear...these people are crazy

. due to all the media attention, i checked out their website in case somone i know is interested in their methods. i'm speechless

.

01-30-2010, 07:20 PM	#2
JessicaTX Rose Garden Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Barrens of Texas Posts: 5,152	Re: Pearl's "plant your tree in the midst of the garden" Well, it didn't work out too well did it? If you take that view it seems like you'd have the view that God set us up to fail. I don't think that was the point of the tree in the garden. __________________ Sam's wife Keegan, Zoe, Anakin and Anaiah's Mom Nonni to Jasper, Iris, Ivory, and Lyric!

01-30-2010, 07:26 PM	#3
BriansLovie Rose Garden Striving to be a gentle mama and enjoying my littles. Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Virginia Posts: 7,696	Re: Pearl's "plant your tree in the midst of the garden" I so despise how he thinks that we must put temptation in front of our children to train them. It seriously makes me ill. __________________ Kara *Sharing life with a special man* Mama to J - 11, J - 9, & A - 5 & Two angels 9/2007 & 1/2008

01-30-2010, 07:28 PM	#4
TuneMyHeart Rose Garden Here's my heart, Lord, take and seal it. Seal it for Thy courts above. Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 22,331	Re: Pearl's "plant your tree in the midst of the garden" why did he put the tree in the garden? I definitely don't think He sets us up to fail, and I would never do that to my children.

01-30-2010, 07:29 PM	#5
Chris3jam Guest Posts: n/a	Re: Pearl's "plant your tree in the midst of the garden" That's my question, as well. Why put the tree in the middle of the Garden? Why not put it were they couldn't get at it?

01-30-2010, 07:31 PM	#6
tigerlily Rose Garden Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Into the sky, all the way out. Posts: 7,377	Re: Pearl's "plant your tree in the midst of the garden" __________________ Hi! I'm Robin married 13 years to my best friend mama to two ~ 9 & 6 years old ‎"Don't they teach recreational maths anymore?" ~The Doctor

01-30-2010, 07:35 PM	#7
Buela Guest Posts: n/a	Re: Pearl's "plant your tree in the midst of the garden" So, with this reasoning, are we supposed to hire a hooker to try to seduce our teenage sons, just to see if they can withstand the temptation? Seriously?

01-30-2010, 07:44 PM	#8
Autumn Deactivated Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 9,445	Re: Pearl's "plant your tree in the midst of the garden" If obedience were our only option it wouldn't be obedience. He wanted us to choose to love him and obey him. If I made a robot that I programmed to wake me up every morning with a warm cup of coffee and tell me how much it loves me, how wonderful I am and how beautiful I look today, it doesn't matter - it's a robot. It was programmed to do that and it's doing that because that's all it can do - it isn't genuine. It doesn't really love me because it's not choosing to love me, it doesn't have any other options. God gave Adam and Eve only one thing that they couldn't do. If he hadn't given them the opportunity to potentially disobey, it wouldn't matter how much they obeyed - it wouldn't have been genuine. I love the people I love because I have made a decision to love them. If I didn't have a choice, it wouldn't be real love. THAT BEING SAID: The Pearls are taking this whole thing way out of context. That's extreme and not fitting with the inconceivable love God has for his children. He doesn't want us to fail - He wants us to really love Him. Last edited by Autumn; 02-11-2010 at 07:03 PM.

01-30-2010, 07:59 PM	#9
tiffany Rose Trellis Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: in the land of grits and sweet tea y'all Posts: 2,436	Re: Pearl's "plant your tree in the midst of the garden" This is probably not going to be a popular opinion here, so I'm prepared for Please hear me out on this and don't hit me just yet. I don't think God put the tree there to temp us, but I do think there are things that are within our reach that he does not remove from our grasp that he teaches us to stay away from. For example, in the NT he says that gentiles are to abstain from blood. Blood is still in people, in animals, in our food, etc. He didn't do away with blood, just because we are not to mess with it. He just gives us the instruction to stay away from it. In the Torah, the command is given to abstain from unclean meat, but those animals are not wiped off the globe, we just have to stay away from them in our diet (if we are TO). He tells us not to look at another with lust, but He doesn't blind us. He tells us not to be sexually immoral, but He doesn't render us unable to do so - not by removing our physical abilities, our emotional abilities, or by removing the opposite sex from our interactions. All those things are still within our grasp, we are just instructed and taught not to go there. I don't think it's healthy to remove any obstacle from out child's grasp and let them run 'willy nilly' - it's just not what God does with us. However, I don't agree with the idea that He put it there to tempt us either. There is a difference between doing something to tempt someone and teaching them not to get involved with something that is plainly there and that we have to learn to work around. Like dressing modestly. We are to be modest in our dress so as not to tempt other men, but we don't have to cut our breasts off so they don't show, ya know? There is balance. We have to be careful about working with the opposite sex. We need to keep things professional and not be one-on-one with a person of the opposite sex if we can help it, certainly not setting ourselves up for temptation, but women don't go work in environments where only other women work and vice versa. We just learn to navigate around it within godly limits. I think that's the hard part of parenting - finding the boundaries and teaching them to our children, so they will learn to apply boundaries to their own lives. I have a friend who doesn't want to teach her children boundaries at all and there have been very uncomfortable situations with her children on many occasions. There has to be balance. Self-control - that's part of the fruit of the spirit, and it has to be developed. __________________ Always Seeking Him... Daughter to The King! Wife to Hubby since Dec 03! Mama to Mr J since Dec 05, Miss E since Dec 07, and Baby H since Oct 10, and Baby M since 12/30/11 With my whole heart I have sought You; Oh, let me not wander from Your commandments! ~Psalm 119:10

02-20-2010, 07:03 PM	#12
mwwr Deactivated It is good to be Queen! Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Nothin' could be finer... Posts: 8,231	Re: Pearl's "plant your tree in the midst of the garden" bbl

02-18-2010, 09:37 PM	#13
breezy Rosebud people i know love "i can has cheezeburger dot com" Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: kansas Posts: 114	Re: Pearl's "plant your tree in the midst of the garden" oh dear...these people are crazy . due to all the media attention, i checked out their website in case somone i know is interested in their methods. i'm speechless . __________________ tara...wife to DH, mama to DD(12/04), DS(10/06), DD (12/08) "if you want to hear God laugh, tell him your plans" "life should be a little nuts, otherwise it's just a bunch of Tuesdays strung together"

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