GBD'd to adulthood: proof in the pudding???

[joystrength]

I ask this in all sincerity.
Has anyone here seen the adult evidence of a GBD'd (more than just AP'd) childhood .. even past the teen years? What are the adults like? I guess this question comes from a few too many "is it really worth it?" moments lately. The struggles, I mean. I know that our God is ultimately in control, but can someone give me some real life examples to "prove" that GBD works ... and not just with young children? I'm looking for more than just "I wasn't spanked."

I know GBD sounds good, and most of the time it feels right, but I need some concrete proof. (If anyone's curious, I have a journalist's background and always have to dig for the proof in said "truth.")

Thanks so much!

Tonya

[ArmsOfLove]

Well . . . my mom didn't have a lot of info on boundaries and I think she was rather permissive at times because of not wanting to be punitive as she was raised , but she stopped spanking when I was 7 and my brothers and I are the products of the foundation of GBD Don't know if that impresses or not

[katiekind]

I hear you and I remember feeling that way too when I struck out on a path that was different from the mainstream.

But I want to preface my remarks with something that's really important for me to share: with human beings I don't think you can really totally "see" proof in the pudding. There is such a kaleidoscope of personality and inescapable family dynamics that affect people. On top of that, we are all just human and flawed and deeply in need of Jesus to have made the sacrifice of his perfect life for our sad shortcomings and muddles and messes and sins. Your kids and mine bear these same human problems. We can't raise perfect kids and I think you'll really let yourself in for some despair and possibly get off track if you focus on outcome too much. Obviously you do want to watch for behavior and signs that tell you what your children need from you and so forth. But something I've learned is this: as parents we can focus on how God wants us to interact with our children: patience, grace, self-control, consideration...we see these qualities in the "one anothers" in Scripture. Leave the "results" in His hands. (This is similar to the way we parents will tell a tattling sibling--"you worry about YOU, I'll worry about Johnny".)

Now having said that, I'll answer your question this way--I get lots of compliments on my children--AP'd and mostly gracefully disciplined. (But like any human, I was not perfect and I look back and see times when I was too permissive and times when I was too controlling and too harsh...)

In our small grace-oriented church I see a lot of wonderful kids of all ages from baby to adult...and I see a variety of application of GBD and AP and some non-GBD and non-AP...what I see that the families of the healthiest kids have in common is parents staying married and committed like crazy to family. I also see a movement towards graceful attitudes in parenting as parents get older and more experienced. Lots of parents who laugh and wonder why they were so uptight about this or that with their older children.

Does that help?

[joystrength]

funny, Kathy, I was just wondering about this seemingly "dead" thread this morning!
God answers!

Thanks so much for your kind and encouraging words. I know I'm deviating a bit from the mainstream. I don't spank, but working on the other punative parts of my "when I'm a parent" psyche.

Thanks again!

I'm sorry that I didn't see this before today. My MIL and FIL raised 10 kids. MIL bfed them all. They all co-slept and moved from actually sleeping with MIL & FIL to sleeping on the floor of their room when the next baby was born. It's odd to see MIL or GMIL without their rebozo (sling), although they're using it mostly for warmth these days. DS has been slung by his grandma and great-grandma. MIL had 9 homebirths, the first and last of which were completely unassisted. The term "AP" hadn't been coined...at least when the oldest were babies, but I'd definitely say that they were AP!

As far as discipline goes, MIL and FIL do not believe in hitting children. DS was spanked once. He doesn't remember how old he was, but he'd lost a goat, so he was obviously old enough to be responsible for that. FIL did it out of anger and frustration, not a philosophy of thinking that spanking would help. We've talked to MIL several times about discipline and her regret is the times that she raised her voice to her children...and that she has one DD who spanks. They didn't do GBD in the sense of the 5 steps, but they were definitely pretty graceful. (Can you tell that I just love them to pieces?)

The results? Of the 5 daughters, 4 live in the same village as my ILs and come every single day to visit with MIL and help her around the house. The other daughter lives in the same metro area, but a different village and comes to see her mama almost every day.

Of the 5 boys, 2 are still in the home. Young'ns. Two are currently in the US working and sending money back home. At last discussion, their intentions were to return home once they had the money to do so and make it financially for a while. Of course, that was DH's intention, too...and then he married me. DH loves his mama and papa so much and has so much respect for them. It's really awesome to see. He left home in his mid-teens to go to the US to work and send money back to his family. We live about 17 hours away from the ILs, but would move back to their village in a heartbeat if finances would allow.

It really is a beautiful family to watch and emulate!

I was going to say, look at Crystal.

I believe that I was GBDed. My mom didn't call it that but we were very very rarely spanked (like 2xs), hardly ever raised their voices at us & if they did we knew they meant business We coslept as long as we needed to, self weaned and used natural consequences. My mom & I were talking the other day and she was telling me about slinging us. One caveat was our teenager years were very rough for various reasons and they kind of left their gbd philosophy (have since returned). I have some emotional scarring from that time. But otherwise I'm a happy well adjusted adult that is fully capable of working fulltime and having a healthy relationship with other adults. I have a great marriage and a great relationship with my children.

[katiekind]

Laura,
I really enjoyed reading about your in-laws.

I am enjoying this thread. I am not exactly sure what GBD stands for and what the 5 pricipals are. I may have read it but don't remember. I am invloved in API so I am familiar with the 8 ideals and wonder if they are similar.

thank you,
Nancy

I practiced ap with all of my children but I'm sad to say I spanked the older ones and was unreasonibly strict (sort of Gothard light) we sheltered them a bit. The younger ones have been gbd.

I have three adult children, three teenagers, and two little ones.

Our three grown daughters are wonderful human beings. They love the L-rd but want nothing to do with church because of our bad experiences when they were younger. I'm hoping this is healed when they have their own children. I was on the phone with my daughter, Joanna, on Saturday. She was devistated because of the death of her good friend, Holly. She told me that she's going on patrol (I'm assuming as I type this) but isn't afraid because, in her words, "I'm not afraid to die because I know where I would go if I was killed." To say the least her faith has been put to the test and has become a comfort to her under horrible cirucmstances.

I have noticed that my three older kids rebelled (not seriously but they *did* rebel) and my three current teenagers are not really rebellous. My 13yo has add which is challenging but none of these guys rebel. They tell us where they're going, they come home when they're supposed to come home (major manifestation of rebellion in older kiddos.) they get good grades (with the exceptions of the struggles with 13yo because of his add) Because the gbd is *relational* we have been able to share our thoughts, philosophies, concerns, beliefs, etc. with these children and don't need to punish or threaten them.

The youngest two have sort of sailed through these stages (no terrible twos, etc.) I honestly don't know if it's the GBD or because they are child #7 and child #8 and we have benifitted from *experience.*

I know, I know much more than the op wanted in a reply.

Debra Baker

[jujubnme]

Originally Posted by Nanny Bee

I am enjoying this thread. I am not exactly sure what GBD stands for and what the 5 pricipals are. I may have read it but don't remember. I am invloved in API so I am familiar with the 8 ideals and wonder if they are similar.

thank you,
Nancy

Welcome, Nancy Bee! GBD = grace-based discipline. Very similar to positive parenting philosophy, but from a Christian POV. You can read about it in the Gentle Discipline forum and in Crystal Lutton's website Arms of Love Family Foundation. The 5 Steps is a very effective discipline tool that many of us use, and you can read about that in a sticky in the GD forum as well.