Death linked to Pearls' advice--sensitive

Palil, it is probably something that the media would prefer to hold at arm's reach, criticizing the likes of Dobson, et al. I agree that the issue will need to be forced...the link between skewed Bible teaching and child abuse.

It may be easier to focus on someone like the Pearls. They have been so open about their teaching. I don't wish 'persecution' on anybody, and I don't feel vindictive toward them (today) but I'm thinking they would be a good focal point. They are articulate, forceful, determined, and prolific in their writing (as opposed to Ezzo, who sounds like a chucklehead and is so dishonest and sneaky, its like nailing jello to a tree to even interview him or his followers....or Dobson who is so widely accepted in the mainstream and has such a huge, middle-of-the-road type readership).

I understand that it's easier to oppose one extreme example of punitive parenting than to address the paradigm as a whole. I just think we must realize that even if the Pearls were debunked and their particular teachings vanished from sight, someone else would quickly take their place--perhaps with a new twist, or an approach that corrects the obvious "errors" in the Pearl's teachings. And, fwiw, there are plenty of families out there for whom Dobson's more palatable presentation of punitive parenting manifests itself in a way that looks very much like what the Pearls teach. As long as the concepts of controlling, punishing, and defeating children are at the core of Christian parenting, there will be child abuse in the name of God, though the names of the teaches may change from one generation to the next.

nowhere do the Pearls suggest 1) wrapping a child with a blanket 2) beating a child so hard as to bruise them 3) beating a child so hard he becomes limp 4) beating a child across the back and leaving bruises 5) using a 2ft pipe purchased from Home Depot. These are all things pulled out of that article, btw. You certainly have a right to voice your concerns, just as others may voice concerns over GD. But...frankly this woman is using the Pearls as a copout, IMO. True, she may have started out using Pearl-specified methods.... but all that stuff in that article was not Pearl recommended.

---------------------------------------------------

Actually, yes it is.

I agree with Chris3jam in that I do seem to remember justifications for leaving marks and some other things. Frankly, though, what each person takes away from the Pearls' writings probably depends on which specific books/article they've read and how much of the detail they absorbed from each. The Pearls talk out of both sides of their mouths on this issue.

I understand what you're saying, though, Sara, and it occurred to me as well. I did not read this at all like you were defending them, btw... just pointing out that from a purely objective/legal POV, Sean's death might not be directly related to the Pearls' advice, since they don't advocate blanket wrapping as a punishment and they can easily defend themselves with the passages in their books that supposedly "define" for parents how to discipline without being abusive. :/ This is exactly why the problem IS the paradigm. They--and many others--teach an overall philosophy that is abusive by nature in its purest form... The abuse may or may not be obvious in each detail, but if it (the paradigm) is followed through to its natural conclusion, the abuse becomes obvious.

Pearl advocates that you continue beating a child until his spirit is broken.

That and the idea of circumventing a parent's natural tenderness toward a child with the false teaching that spanking is Biblically mandated is a lethal combination.

Yes, Debra. And those 2 aspects are present in the teaching of every punitive Christian parenting "expert" out there. I've seen some really awful abuse in homes that supposedly followed Dobson. Truth is, the parents were no longer following Dobson's *specific* advice, but they took the paradigm he teaches and applied their own version of it.

Mamas,

Straw-man bashing is against board rules.

We are all shocked and grieved by this senseless death, and it is natural for us to seek someone to hold accountable. While we are being forthright and outspoken about the violence in the Pearls' teachings, let's be sure our posts reflect the grace that we are striving to walk in. None of us is above reprehensible sin, and none of us are too far gone to be reached by God's grace, should He see fit to extend it... including Michael Pearl and the mothers out there who have followed his teachings in error. May God allow this terrible tragedy to further His greater purpose

[BluegrassMama]

Thank you, Palil. I'm bowing out now, and looking forward to hearing more about QG's pamphlets, and getting some Tshirts from Rebecca.

The shock and personal feelings that came out of this story are subsiding now, and I think it is time for me to just hug my babies and spend more time on my knees for everyone deceived, including the Pearls themselves.

[milkmommy]

Originally Posted by Titus2Momof4

With all due respect.....

This is not said to ruffle any feathers....and I respect your right(s) to your opinion, and freedom of speech (letter-writing agendas). But, I am wondering what is going to happen when the people you are writing to actually LOOK at the books by the Pearls, and they see that nowhere do the Pearls suggest 1) wrapping a child with a blanket 2) beating a child so hard as to bruise them 3) beating a child so hard he becomes limp 4) beating a child across the back and leaving bruises 5) using a 2ft pipe purchased from Home Depot. These are all things pulled out of that article, btw. You certainly have a right to voice your concerns, just as others may voice concerns over GD. But...frankly this woman is using the Pearls as a copout, IMO. True, she may have started out using Pearl-specified methods.... but all that stuff in that article was not Pearl recommended.

Actually thye do at least most the blanket I'm not sure about but the rest..

whipping a 3 year old until he is "totally broken."

a mother should hit her child if he cries for her.

if a child does obey before being whipped, whip them anyway. And "if you have to sit on him to spank him, then do not hesitate. And hold him there until he is surrendered. Prove that you are bigger, tougher." "Defeat him totally."

.

"Don't be bullied. Give him more of the same." They say to continue whipping until their crying turns into a "wounded, submissive whimper."

and for the plumbing supply,,,

2

The rod we speak of is a plumbing supply line that can be bought at any hardware store or large department store. It is a slim, flexible, plastic tubing that supplies water to sinks, and toilets. Ask for "¼ inch supply line." They cost less than one dollar.

from Michel Pearls NGJ

Deanna

[flowermama]

While we are being forthright and outspoken about the violence in the Pearls' teachings, let's be sure our posts reflect the grace that we are striving to walk in. None of us is above reprehensible sin, and none of us are too far gone to be reached by God's grace, should He see fit to extend it... including Michael Pearl and the mothers out there who have followed his teachings in error. May God allow this terrible tragedy to further His greater purpose

Amen.

[hsgbdmama]

Originally Posted by Titus2Momof4

5) using a 2ft pipe purchased from Home Depot. These are all things pulled out of that article, btw.

Actually, this part is on the Pearl's NGJ website, in the second part of their Biblical Chastisement article -- I looked it up and printed the articles to my disk. I am not going to directly quote but they do state:

* Use a section of 1/4" plumbers supply line for spankings
* That it will fit into your purse or around your neck
* That you can buy it for $1.00 or less at Home Depot or any other store of this kind
* That you get a better deal by purchasing them by the dozen
* That they can be distributed in every room of your home and you can keep one in each of your vehicles

So no, it is not just their article, and the article was quoting what they found at NGJ, which is owned and operated by the Pearls.

[cklewis]

I just got to this. Sigh. . . . Wow.

Another way of spreading the good word of God's grace in a very, very small way is to check out my former student's blog (mraab is a member here) and add your two cents': http://monicaraab.blogspot.com/ Her March 16th post includes this. And a few of my former students are talking about it. . . . I started, but well. . . . I'm not the total expert and right now I'm not real clear, yk? I would appreciate your help.

for God to stop this.

C

[at home momma]

Originally Posted by JandSmama

Actually, this part is on the Pearl's NGJ website, in the second part of their Biblical Chastisement article -- I looked it up and printed the articles to my disk. I am not going to directly quote but they do state:

* Use a section of 1/4" plumbers supply line for spankings
* That it will fit into your purse or around your neck
* That you can buy it for $1.00 or less at Home Depot or any other store of this kind
* That you get a better deal by purchasing them by the dozen
* That they can be distributed in every room of your home and you can keep one in each of your vehicles

So no, it is not just their article, and the article was quoting what they found at NGJ, which is owned and operated by the Pearls.

I have to say, there is a huge difference between 'pipe' and plumber's supply line. As a person who has done plumbing, there is no way to substitue one for the other. pipe is metal and rigid and heavy. plumber's supply line is plastic and flexible. not saying either one is right, but obviously to a thinking parent you aren't going to beat your kids with a metal pipe. use your common sense.

i think this mom is definitely using the pearls as a cop out. she's thinking if she says 'oh it isn't my fault it's all b/c of this book i read." she'll be in not as much trouble.

While i don't agree with all the Pearl's methods, i really don't think they are responsible here. The woman's child died by suffocation from being wrapped in blankets too tightly. this sounds like some sort of Re Attachment therapy, kind of like 'holding therapy' gone awry.

at home momma

[milkmommy]

I have to say, there is a huge difference between 'pipe' and plumber's supply line. As a person who has done plumbing, there is no way to substitue one for the other. pipe is metal and rigid and heavy. plumber's supply line is plastic and flexible. not saying either one is right, but obviously to a thinking parent you aren't going to beat your kids with a metal pipe. use your common sense.

Well the article doesn't say they used a pipe its says they used a plumbing supply line
From the article

he found literature by an evangelical minister and his wife who recommended using plumbing supply lines to spank misbehaving children.

While i don't agree with all the Pearl's methods, i really don't think they are responsible here. The woman's child died by suffocation from being wrapped in blankets too tightly. this sounds like some sort of Re Attachment therapy, kind of like 'holding therapy' gone awry.

Yet I wonder if they would have reverted to this treatment if they hadnt believed the dribbled learned from the Pearl books promising "perfect kids" and accusing parents of being soft week and bad parents if they didn't do so.

Deanna

[Wonder Woman]

Sean died after being wrapped so tightly in blankets he suffocated. That, too, was a form of punishment, Johnston County Sheriff Steve Bizzell said.

So no, I don't think it was Attachment Therapy

I do apologize if I've been straw man bashing. I *am* attaching blame, though, and I freely admit that. I'm attaching blame to the Pearls. To the Ezzos. To Dobson. To all the people who proclaim themselves experts and then promote violence in the name of God. To whoever made the decision to allow the adoption of Sean to go through, even after seeing the marks of violence on him. To a system that's so messed up that willing and qualified bio families can't keep their relatives. To the culture we live in that accepts violence toward children as being something they deserve, or asked for , or had coming.

There's plenty of blame to go around

If my words have been less than gracious, I'm sorry. (At least I didn't call him a Twinkie twerp, or a brat, or a monster, or a little dictator, or a bundle of defiance )

And I've been clear about this in the past, and will be clear about it here again : I in no way hold it against any mother here who has spanked her dc in the past. I'm in that category myself I have friends who spank. I have family members who spank. And it breaks my heart, and I pray for them, and I do my best to be an example of GBD toward them.

However, I think by virtue of their status in the public eye, people like the Pearls are inviting public scrutiny. No, I don't know them personally. But I do know personally the fruits of their ministry, and they aren't the fruits of the Spirit.

I don't want to see them boiled in oil or even see the same pain inflicted on them that they have caused (directly or indirectly) to be inflicted on children.

I do want them to run headlong into Grace.

[Wonder Woman]

just pointing out that from a purely objective/legal POV, Sean's death might not be directly related to the Pearls' advice, since they don't advocate blanket wrapping as a punishment and they can easily defend themselves with the passages in their books that supposedly "define" for parents how to discipline without being abusive.

I don't for one minute think that the Pearls want any child to be killed I think they are just as sickened by that level of violence as we all are. However, I do think their eyes and hearts are blinded to the fact that their mindset, and forceful advocacy of such mindset, can lead to this. GBD has never been the death of any child, physically or spiritually. Punitive parenting has

Legally, I hope a link can be proven. I pray it can. Not because I'm wishing trouble on the Pearls, but because maybe then they will be made to stop instigating a violent paradigm.

And I'm not sure how they can easily defend against charges of abuse when they mention things like hosing off a toddler, naked, in the yard - because he was 'enjoying' the 'loving attention' of his mother during diaper changes. That in and of itself is abusive, as is so much more.

Our society has allowed teaching like that to hide behind a cloak of religious liberty for far too long. And as non-interventionist as I'd like our government to be - well....I don't see any women complaining that our rights were violated by the domestic violence laws. I don't see any persons of color wishing for a return to the pre-civil rights era.

I'd love to see the evil satan intended with this senseless death turned to the good of protecting our most vulnerable fellow human beings

[hsgbdmama]

Rebecca!

The other thing that I would like to see come out of this is to eliminate the perception that Christian = punitive/corporal punishment parenting (and even stronger stereotype if it is Christian + Homeschooling = punitive/corporal punishment parenting). This type of tragedy and the soundbite media attention it gains only contributes to this incorrect stereotype.

[milkmommy]

Originally Posted by jadensmom

I don't for one minute think that the Pearls want any child to be killed I think they are just as sickened by that level of violence as we all are. However, I do think their eyes and hearts are blinded to the fact that their mindset, and forceful advocacy of such mindset, can lead to this. GBD has never been the death of any child, physically or spiritually. Punitive parenting has

Legally, I hope a link can be proven. I pray it can. Not because I'm wishing trouble on the Pearls, but because maybe then they will be made to stop instigating a violent paradigm.

And I'm not sure how they can easily defend against charges of abuse when they mention things like hosing off a toddler, naked, in the yard - because he was 'enjoying' the 'loving attention' of his mother during diaper changes. That in and of itself is abusive, as is so much more.

Our society has allowed teaching like that to hide behind a cloak of religious liberty for far too long. And as non-interventionist as I'd like our government to be - well....I don't see any women complaining that our rights were violated by the domestic violence laws. I don't see any persons of color wishing for a return to the pre-civil rights era.

I'd love to see the evil satan intended with this senseless death turned to the good of protecting our most vulnerable fellow human beings

Deanna

This story is heartbreaking.

Originally Posted by JandSmama

Rebecca!

The other thing that I would like to see come out of this is to eliminate the perception that Christian = punitive/corporal punishment parenting (and even stronger stereotype if it is Christian + Homeschooling = punitive/corporal punishment parenting). This type of tragedy and the soundbite media attention it gains only contributes to this incorrect stereotype.

I agree... that really bothers me

[UltraMother]

No words, no words. I could've been that mama too, several years ago.