when my 7 yr. old dd .....................

[thomer]

Stomping I usually don't do anything about. I figure he has to have at least one outlet for his anger, and stomping feels good if you're really upset I let him growl or complain too. Just no name calling.

I don't allow rolling of eyes either, but I know he picked that up from me I have to stop myself too.

As far as happy heart - I don't always have one, and he doesn't have to either. If he wants to complain and moan while we're cleaning up I'll usually join right in. By the end of the task we usually feel better.

If it's gone on too long, I sometimes do say though, "Life is not always fair or fun, and sometimes you just have to deal with it and/or accept it."

For stomping I would direct him to a place were he can stomp out his anger. I told my 8 year old ds to jump outside if he needed to jump. He could also do it in the basement.

[Iveyrock]

Originally Posted by amytug

well I dont mind her being grumpy about what i originally asked her to go to her room about, it's being grumpy about my having her walk nicely that is annoying. does that make sense? And I want obedience not compliance. There is no reason for you to have an attitude toward me because I'm asking you to not walk like a dinosaur

And I am still in the camp that they n eed to have a happy heart. If my boss (I dont have one but figuratively speaking) asked me to clean up a mess I made- if I do it with an attitude that "I can't beelive he just asked me to clean this up- he's got 2 hands, he can clean it up himself" I'm going to feel gumpy and resentful. I dont need dd being grumpy and resentful. I"m going to help her have a happy heart when cleaning up her mess so that she's not resentful and grumpy.

As others have pointed out, there's really nothing you can do to make her have a happy heart. You can set her up for success there, but you really can't make it happen.

Very gently - you gave the example of doing what your boss tells you... but how is your heart when you are going about the daily tasks of caring for your kids and taking care of your house? It is an awfully high standard to set for anyone to always have a good attitude about everything they are asked to do, and especially high for a seven year old. There is room to be proud of her and give her credit for doing what she was supposed to do at all.

[MomtoJGJ]

I'm also looking for ideas for my 6.5yo I have a couple of questions that I think fit in here though...

How do you say "I'm sorry you're frustrated, but....." without saying I'm sorry? I've noticed two things from DD1 when I said that... first of all, I really am not sorry most of the time... I'm not angry, just not sorry and she catches that. and secondly, she has started apologizing without meaning it just because of me saying that phrase.

Also, if it's ok for them to fuss and complain about things while they are doing them then what does Philippians 2:14 "Do everything without grumbling and arguing" mean?

[hopeforchange]

you can't force obedience. it's a great goal to want obedience instead of compliance, but that comes as your child grows and matures. obedience is about what's in the child's heart. and you can't force a happy heart...you can only force happy behavior/face. and in doing so, my guess would be that you rarely have a happy heart.

[newday]

Originally Posted by MomtoJGJ

I'm also looking for ideas for my 6.5yo I have a couple of questions that I think fit in here though...

How do you say "I'm sorry you're frustrated, but....." without saying I'm sorry? I've noticed two things from DD1 when I said that... first of all, I really am not sorry most of the time... I'm not angry, just not sorry and she catches that. and secondly, she has started apologizing without meaning it just because of me saying that phrase.

Also, if it's ok for them to fuss and complain about things while they are doing them then what does Philippians 2:14 "Do everything without grumbling and arguing" mean?

first bolded bit: I don't say I am sorry. I am not. I say, "you are frustrated. You may not try to punish us by yelling (or whatever is going on.)" or "I can tell you are frustrated. Would you like a hug before you do this task?" or "you seem really frustrated."

second bit: It is not ok for them to fuss and complain about things while they are doing them. They do lots of things that are not ok. We model correct behaviour. We use every teachable moment. We win their hearts and hope they mimic us. We pick and choose which things need the most attention and discipline (trying not to exasperate...)

does that make sense?
I think if we do every thing without grumbling and arguing then we are well on the way to teaching our children. As they make mistakes we can stop their behaviour and empathize with their big feelings.

[MomtoJGJ]

ok... for some reason just not saying it did not cross my mind... I feel silly now

and for the second thing... that's how I was doing it, but this thread made it feel like it was ok for anyone to grumble and complain I misunderstood the intent of the posts if it was just saying that they'll make mistakes.

[newday]

i probably wasn't very clear in expressing myself

[mamaKristin]

Originally Posted by amytug

And I want obedience not compliance. There is no reason for you to have an attitude toward me because I'm asking you to not walk like a dinosaur

And I am still in the camp that they n eed to have a happy heart. If my boss (I dont have one but figuratively speaking) asked me to clean up a mess I made- if I do it with an attitude that "I can't beelive he just asked me to clean this up- he's got 2 hands, he can clean it up himself" I'm going to feel gumpy and resentful. I dont need dd being grumpy and resentful. I"m going to help her have a happy heart when cleaning up her mess so that she's not resentful and grumpy.

I think you are getting the ideas backwards. Compliance is not optional, doing things out of obedience is.

How often do *you* do all things every day with a "happy heart"? I know that I struggle with it, and I don't know that it's fair or right to demand from our children what we are not able to do. I'm not saying it's ok to grumble , but rather how hard is it to act with a "happy heart" when we are being told to do something we would rather not do? I know that if I want attention from my family, and have that attention removed, I'm going to be upset. It's neither good nor bad that I feel that way, it just *is*. Denying that feeling isn't helpful or healthy. Which is why teaching appropriate ways to react at non-conflict times is helpful and productive.

[canadiyank]

Originally Posted by MomtoJGJ

How do you say "I'm sorry you're frustrated, but....." without saying I'm sorry?

As a PP said, you don't need to say, "I'm sorry" if you're not. Reflecting feelings can be, "You feel...," or, "You seem to feel..." (I use "You seem to feel a lot, since I truly don't know what they're feeling and also sometimes they'd focus on that..."NO! I'm NOT x, y, z.").

Also, I avoid saying "but" after reflecting feeling b/c that basically negates what you've said before. Instead, simply make it a separate sentence, i.e., "You seem to feel really frustrated! It's not ok to slam doors. Try again."

From the Dealing With Disappointment thread:

First, the steps for dealing with a crisis:

1. Check for safety. Move anyone or anything being hurt.
2. Acknowledge feelings. "It's ok to feel ____." (Identifying feelings gives them a feelings vocabulary, that feelings are acceptable, and that their feelings are different from actions. It's ok to "guess" at their feelings and be wrong...they're still learning and if they can tell you're wrong, great!)
3. Set limits. "And I will not let you _____." (Notice use of "and" here instead of "but," which can negate or minimize their feelings you idenitified in step 2.)
4. Offer choices. "You may ____ or _____ instead." (These are the skills you've introduced at other times.)
5. Offer support. "Would you like me to ___?" ("Offering support may be tricky. Some children want to be left alone, others feel abandoned if you leave. You can ask what the child wants, but remember that she may really not know. You may need to experiment to see what works best." p. 17.)

Originally Posted by MomtoJGJ

Also, if it's ok for them to fuss and complain about things while they are doing them then what does Philippians 2:14 "Do everything without grumbling and arguing" mean?

I don't require a "happy heart" but at the same time I'm not ok with rude tones of voices or actions. At a neutral time we've talked about the differences between rude and polite. I will be the example of rude, huffing around and rolling eyes, etc. They think it's really funny, me being "rude." Then I show them what I'd rather see/hear. They may not *feel* that way, and I understand that! But I think it's completely reasonable to ask them to curb the rude tones of voices and actions in their responses to me. I provide other outlets for self-calming.

So I'll say, "Try again with a calm tone of voice." Or I'll completely script what I want to hear, "I need you to try again, 'Ok mom,' with a pleasant tone of voice." "I understand you feel upset. It's not ok to treat me rudely. Please try again."

Originally Posted by amytug

screams at the top of her lungs beause she didn't get her way. What do I do?

kicks her brother out of my sight. he syas she did - she lies and says "no I dind't- he kicked himself" or "no Id idn't hit dayna she hit her own head into the wall." what do I do?

stomps across the house, what do I do?

slams doors, what do I do?

She's very very difficult...



Right nowshe is "tomato staked" meaning she's not leaving my side and will probably help me make dinner, etc. but really I dont know what else to do.. or if this is even ok.

Just wanted to add my 2 cents...

we've been getting a lot of this at our house, and I since my ds1 is quite physical, I always took my ds2's word for it even though my ds1 would say "he hit himself!" or whatever. Well, the other day they were arguing behind me in the kitchen, and I turned to say something to them and I saw my ds2 SLAP HIMSELF. I was horrified. I wonder now how often my ds1 was telling the truth and I didn't believe him!! Just a thought...

[Serafine]

I have only read the OP, but I wanted to address the lying issue.

I am a VERY strong believer that we should be trusting our children unless we have clear evidence that they are actually lying.

SO, in this situation...if it happened out of my sight, I would comfort the one who was hurt, but I would NOT accuse the other one of lying to me.

I would (and have done this) clearly say that, "I wasn't there, I don't know what happened, but you are my child and I am choosing to trust you. You can ALWAYS tell me the truth and we will figure a way to make things right."

That way...hurt child is still comforted for being hurt. Relationship with other child is still intact, and you have given them an opportunity to come clean if they in fact were lying.