Gentle Christian Mothers Community
 
Random Quotes from Wise Mamas

~* Please help keep GCM free by using our
Amazon.com affiliate link. Thank you! *~


Go Back   Gentle Christian Mothers Community > Specific Issues > Unprepared for Parenting (Ezzos, Pearls, Etc.) *Public*
Forgot Password? Join Us!

Unprepared for Parenting (Ezzos, Pearls, Etc.) *Public* Support and information for those affected by the Ezzos, the Pearls, and other punitive and adversarial methods of child-rearing.
A public forum.
Before posting here, please read this sticky and keep guideline 23 in mind:

23. No posts harshly dissecting parenting moments of others since we desire to humbly cultivate a heart attitude of grace and not judgment towards other mamas. We all struggle at times as parents and have much to learn, and GCM's focus is to provide tools and information for each of us to parent more effectively. Posts voicing some frustration regarding choices made by others can be okay, but it needs to be within the overall context of seeking understanding or ideas for better responses in the future.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 02-12-2009, 05:04 PM   #1
debf
Guest
 
 
Posts: n/a
Default Could Some Forms Of Punitive Parenting Lead To Creating A Sociopath?

I have read before that most sociopaths are not violent individuals. They are the unscrupulous sales man(I am not saying that being a sales person leads to dishonest behavior, by the way), the serial cheater, the charming boy or girl friend who emotionally manipulates another person etc.

Some of the tactics that I read when I look into some of the punitive style sound as if these gurus are trying to create a sociopath. For example, teaching a child to pretend to be cheerful no matter how angry that they might be, or that a person with authority-whether they be a parent, husband or pastor-has unquestioning power over those who are under them.

Have their been any studies that show that such extreme parenting styles lead to creating some adults who have severe trouble with empathy?

  Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2009, 06:04 PM   #2
Chris3jam
Rose Garden
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 11,861
Chris3jam has disabled reputation
Default Re: Could Some Forms Of Punitive Parenting Lead To Creating A Sociopath?

Hm. I'm not sure. I know that there are studies that show that abuse or neglect can lead to it.
__________________
Wielder of the Cutlass of Acerbic Wit and the Phaser of Perseverance!
Chris3jam is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2009, 06:19 PM   #3
ArmsOfLove
Rose Garden
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 79,657
ArmsOfLove has disabled reputation
Default Re: Could Some Forms Of Punitive Parenting Lead To Creating A Sociopath?

My personal opinion, and things I have seen in children raised with his methods, is that Ezzo could have written the manual for how to raise a sociopath. The detachment, the emphasis on day one that the child is "not the center of the universe", and ignoring cries . . . I've read a lot of true crime over the years and there are just common factors that tend to play into sociopaths and certain things are almost always part of their past.

Of course I also have to say that some of the sweetest people in the world were parented in less than stellar methods and continued to be the sweetest people in the world. So I do not believe that people are the sum total of how they were parented.

I do believe that there are all sorts of risks that can come into play when nature meets nurture with the wrong combination
ArmsOfLove is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2009, 06:41 PM   #4
Emerald Orchid
Rose Garden
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Québec, Canada
Posts: 8,596
Emerald Orchid has a reputation beyond reputeEmerald Orchid has a reputation beyond reputeEmerald Orchid has a reputation beyond reputeEmerald Orchid has a reputation beyond reputeEmerald Orchid has a reputation beyond reputeEmerald Orchid has a reputation beyond reputeEmerald Orchid has a reputation beyond reputeEmerald Orchid has a reputation beyond reputeEmerald Orchid has a reputation beyond reputeEmerald Orchid has a reputation beyond reputeEmerald Orchid has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Could Some Forms Of Punitive Parenting Lead To Creating A Sociopath?

I was listening to a talk show today on the radio and the topic was about was makes psychopaths what they are. One of the common factors (although not exclusive, like Crystal pointed out) was a mother who over-shielded and built a narcisstic relationship around her son. So I can see how other parenting dynamics could foster other extreme negative behaviors.

But then again, there are socio/psychopaths who come from pretty normal homes. So it goes both ways.
__________________

French-Canadian / Reader / TrailRunner / T4 / INTj / Wife to S
SAHM to 3 DS
Z (8.5) M (6.5) and T (3.5)
Adopting from China
Emerald Orchid is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2009, 08:03 PM   #5
Lantern Light Mama
Deactivated
I support GCM!
 
A.K.A. joyinthspirit
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: stuck in a labor time warp
Posts: 11,749
Lantern Light Mama has a reputation beyond reputeLantern Light Mama has a reputation beyond reputeLantern Light Mama has a reputation beyond reputeLantern Light Mama has a reputation beyond reputeLantern Light Mama has a reputation beyond reputeLantern Light Mama has a reputation beyond reputeLantern Light Mama has a reputation beyond reputeLantern Light Mama has a reputation beyond reputeLantern Light Mama has a reputation beyond reputeLantern Light Mama has a reputation beyond reputeLantern Light Mama has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Could Some Forms Of Punitive Parenting Lead To Creating A Sociopath?

Quote:
So I do not believe that people are the sum total of how they were parented.
Amen!
Lantern Light Mama is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2009, 08:09 PM   #6
saturnfire16
Rose Garden
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: North Eastern CA
Posts: 9,121
saturnfire16 has disabled reputation
Default Re: Could Some Forms Of Punitive Parenting Lead To Creating A Sociopath?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Green Orchid
I was listening to a talk show today on the radio and the topic was about was makes psychopaths what they are. One of the common factors (although not exclusive, like Crystal pointed out) was a mother who over-shielded and built a narcisstic relationship around her son. So I can see how other parenting dynamics could foster other extreme negative behaviors.

But then again, there are socio/psychopaths who come from pretty normal homes. So it goes both ways.
But how do we know those homes were "normal." A lot of them are normal in the 2 kids, dog, white picket fence, steady jobs, go to church every sunday kind of way. That doesn't make their childrearing methods normal or safe.
__________________
~Emily
INTJ, Type 4

Wife to D
Mama to:
E 12/05
L 7/08
Z 12/10
A 6/14
and J in heaven 2/10

Torah Keeping, Unschooling Family

My blog on unschooling and family life: Peace On Dark Nights.
saturnfire16 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2009, 08:16 PM   #7
aburrows
Guest
 
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: Could Some Forms Of Punitive Parenting Lead To Creating A Sociopath?

For more info read Sociopath Next Door...its a great book and will give you an idea about some factors that could cause people to become sociopaths. Very very good book. I have a psych degree and a step brother who I fully believe is a sociopath. And according to the book a common denominator is the relationship the person has with their mother. But that book is the best one I have found to help explain it If you want more info I can find my book and answer questions
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2009, 08:21 PM   #8
Rabbit
Deactivated
I support GCM!
 
You know how we say, "It works both ways!"
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: In the Neighborhood
Posts: 39,782
Rabbit has a reputation beyond reputeRabbit has a reputation beyond reputeRabbit has a reputation beyond reputeRabbit has a reputation beyond reputeRabbit has a reputation beyond reputeRabbit has a reputation beyond reputeRabbit has a reputation beyond reputeRabbit has a reputation beyond reputeRabbit has a reputation beyond reputeRabbit has a reputation beyond reputeRabbit has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Could Some Forms Of Punitive Parenting Lead To Creating A Sociopath?

It is dangerous to look to the parents for an explanation of their offspring's mental illness. Freud tried it a lot, but there are no truly conclusive studies on the subject. Yes, you can make anything worse, or better, through parenting, but to create a sociopath from a mind that is otherwise healthy would take extreme abuse.
Rabbit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2009, 09:57 PM   #9
debf
Guest
 
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: Could Some Forms Of Punitive Parenting Lead To Creating A Sociopath?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rabbit
It is dangerous to look to the parents for an explanation of their offspring's mental illness. Freud tried it a lot, but there are no truly conclusive studies on the subject. Yes, you can make anything worse, or better, through parenting, but to create a sociopath from a mind that is otherwise healthy would take extreme abuse.
I should have used the word influenced instead of created. I do not think that we are merely victims of our childhoods nor do I think that a sociopath can't come out of a 'normal' household.

Some studies do show that emotional abuse can dampen a person's ability to feel empathy. I don't know if this is a shot term effect that disappears once the victim escapes the abuse.

I have read that some of Freud's patients might have been sexual abuse victims but his own personal mindset wouldn't accept that sexual abuse occurred in 'regular' families. I don't know if this is true or not.

I know some people have pointed out that a narcissistic mother can damage her children, but what about a narcissistic father? Isn't he damaging also.
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2009, 10:00 PM   #10
Rabbit
Deactivated
I support GCM!
 
You know how we say, "It works both ways!"
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: In the Neighborhood
Posts: 39,782
Rabbit has a reputation beyond reputeRabbit has a reputation beyond reputeRabbit has a reputation beyond reputeRabbit has a reputation beyond reputeRabbit has a reputation beyond reputeRabbit has a reputation beyond reputeRabbit has a reputation beyond reputeRabbit has a reputation beyond reputeRabbit has a reputation beyond reputeRabbit has a reputation beyond reputeRabbit has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Could Some Forms Of Punitive Parenting Lead To Creating A Sociopath?

There are different kinds of sociopathic behaviours or diseases, too. And a difference between psychopaths and sociopaths.

Reactive attachment disorder, left untreated, can lead to sociopathic behaviour.
Rabbit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2009, 10:02 PM   #11
ArmsOfLove
Rose Garden
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 79,657
ArmsOfLove has disabled reputation
Default Re: Could Some Forms Of Punitive Parenting Lead To Creating A Sociopath?

Quote:
I have read that some of Freud's patients might have been sexual abuse victims but his own personal mindset wouldn't accept that sexual abuse occurred in 'regular' families. I don't know if this is true or not.
actually, he first published his studies to say that sexual abuse caused latent memories and fears and in the Victorian era where there was an incredible amount of sexual abuse Freud found himself with all his funding pulled. He regrouped and republished his paper and blamed it on the child's desires and his funding returned
ArmsOfLove is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2009, 10:32 PM   #12
tigerlily
Rose Garden
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Into the sky, all the way out.
Posts: 7,380
tigerlily has a reputation beyond reputetigerlily has a reputation beyond reputetigerlily has a reputation beyond reputetigerlily has a reputation beyond reputetigerlily has a reputation beyond reputetigerlily has a reputation beyond reputetigerlily has a reputation beyond reputetigerlily has a reputation beyond reputetigerlily has a reputation beyond reputetigerlily has a reputation beyond reputetigerlily has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Could Some Forms Of Punitive Parenting Lead To Creating A Sociopath?

Quote:
but what about a narcissistic father? Isn't he damaging also.
I had a friend in college with a narcissistic father and it was definitely very damaging -- just as it would be to have a parent with any debilitating mental disease.
__________________
Hi! I'm Robin
married 13 years to my best friend
mama to two ~ 9 & 6 years old

‎"Don't they teach recreational maths anymore?"
~The Doctor
tigerlily is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2009, 10:41 PM   #13
sweetpeasmommy
Moderator in Breaking the Chains, Children with Special and Medical Needs, Natural Health & Nutrition, and Prayer & Praise
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 27,267
sweetpeasmommy has a reputation beyond reputesweetpeasmommy has a reputation beyond reputesweetpeasmommy has a reputation beyond reputesweetpeasmommy has a reputation beyond reputesweetpeasmommy has a reputation beyond reputesweetpeasmommy has a reputation beyond reputesweetpeasmommy has a reputation beyond reputesweetpeasmommy has a reputation beyond reputesweetpeasmommy has a reputation beyond reputesweetpeasmommy has a reputation beyond reputesweetpeasmommy has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Could Some Forms Of Punitive Parenting Lead To Creating A Sociopath?

My therapist says my brother is a sociopath. And we were raised in a very punitive, unattached, ignore your feelings because you are not important type of home. He beat me far more than my parents ever did among other things. I don't know how he seems to others, but probably not the salesman type. Actually after looking up both definitions, I think she may have said psychopath, that seems to fit better.
__________________
Amy eNFp


Wife to ISTJ DH 1997
Mom to one Sweet Boy 10/2004

sweetpeasmommy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2009, 11:31 PM   #14
Lantern Light Mama
Deactivated
I support GCM!
 
A.K.A. joyinthspirit
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: stuck in a labor time warp
Posts: 11,749
Lantern Light Mama has a reputation beyond reputeLantern Light Mama has a reputation beyond reputeLantern Light Mama has a reputation beyond reputeLantern Light Mama has a reputation beyond reputeLantern Light Mama has a reputation beyond reputeLantern Light Mama has a reputation beyond reputeLantern Light Mama has a reputation beyond reputeLantern Light Mama has a reputation beyond reputeLantern Light Mama has a reputation beyond reputeLantern Light Mama has a reputation beyond reputeLantern Light Mama has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Could Some Forms Of Punitive Parenting Lead To Creating A Sociopath?

Come to think of it, I have 3 sisters. The third, four years older than I was diagnosed with a borderline personality disorder, not quite the same as a sociopath, I know. She was beaten on a regular basis however, which I think led to her developing this type of disorder. :/ Fortunately, I was never beaten with a belt, but I witnessed the abuse in our home (which we all know is damaging in its own way). So, while over all, I don't feel abuse makes a person who they are, it may start the ball rolling in that direction, if the person may already be predisposed to developing a mental illness.
Lantern Light Mama is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-2009, 09:22 AM   #15
Chris3jam
Rose Garden
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 11,861
Chris3jam has disabled reputation
Default Re: Could Some Forms Of Punitive Parenting Lead To Creating A Sociopath?

The problem with that sort of research is that hindsight is 20/20. The link between nature and nuture is not fully understood. We can 'guess' all we want, but we'll never be able to explain what may already be "miswired" naturally in someone that is brought out by or intensified by nurture, or if it would have happened any way, or why sometimes those with unbelievably horrendous childhoods can grow up to be some of the nicest people. One example is "The Boy Called It". Why did I turn out so incredibly different from my family? From the same family, one sees variation. No one can explain that yet. I think there is an incredible amount of danger in ascribing certain behaviours, and the way a child 'turns out', to just the way that child was raised.
__________________
Wielder of the Cutlass of Acerbic Wit and the Phaser of Perseverance!
Chris3jam is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 12:05 AM.


A variety of opinions and ideas are shared on GCM. Personal experiences, suggestions, and tips found here are in no way intended to substitute for medical counsel from a healthcare professional. Always use your own good judgement and seek professional advice when in doubt about a health concern.

Amazon.com affiliate link

Copyright 1997-2017 by Gentle Christian Mothers™
An alternative-minded, evangelical Christian community supporting attachment parenting and natural living.

Do not post content elsewhere.
http://www.gentlechristianmothers.com/community/

Some smilies created and copyrighted by Mazeguy.
Some smilies and avatars created and copyrighted by flowermama and children -- do not use elsewhere.

Soli Deo Gloria
To God only wise, be glory through Jesus Christ for ever. Amen. ~ Romans 16:27 (KJV)

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.3
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.