[flowermama]

(I apologize that my post is kind of all over the place. I wanted to respond to so many things, and didn't even get to everything, and it was a little overwhelming for me. lol . . .)

Originally Posted by Striving4Grace

In fact if you even mention the TTUAC book you can see visible disgust in the eyes of Pastor Tedd and Margy.

That is so wonderful to hear.

They are very kind, patient and loving people and I do admit it doesn't necessarily come though in the book but my entire family owes them a debit of gratitude as the healing that has happened as we have detoxed from TTUAC is amazing and for the very first time I can see that my children's salvation most certainly does not depend on anything outside of Christ.

I am happy to hear how you have learned good things from them and they have blessed your family. I praise God that He is working through them to help you heal.

I understand that there are a great deal of ladies here who find even the mere concept of spanking so repugnant that it is impossible to see those who advocate it as anything but monsters themselves writing child abuse manuals and I agree with that in regards to the Pearls due to my own experience.

He teaches some things in his book SACH that leave me feeling very sad and very concerned, but I don't think your pastor is a monster, and I can see why you love and admire him and his wife.

I am here to learn more about gentle discipline using logical consequences since that is what type of discipline I was advised to use.

I'm so glad you are here and wanting to learn along with us on this journey.

Another thing to be careful about, even when all other advice is good, is when the concept of defiance is presented as something to be especially feared.

TwoKids, I really agree.

What Tripp and Pearl and Dobson fail to see is that raising your kids doesn't have to be an "us vs them" event.

J3K, definitely the us vs. them paradigm is of concern. You are so right.

I think where we part company with Tripp is at this point. He sees spanking as reasonable, we do not. We all agree about consequences to negative behaviors - be it the removal of an item the child can't handle responsibly all the way to an older child needing to rebuild trust in their relationship beteen them and their parent. We don't agree that causing pain is logical for an issue of trust or respect or responsiblity. Avoidence of pain more often teaches a child to 'not get caught' long before it teaches them to modify their behavior based on understanding or maturing. 'Reeping what you have sown' is about natural conseqences, 'what I am doing to you' is about a parent's decision to apply pain on top of natural consequence at their discretion.

I think you explained that so well, elcollins.

Originally Posted by Hermana Linda

Striving4Grace, It must be very hard to hear these things being said about your pastor. I hope you don't feel attacked. We are trying very hard to be gentle, but we are also very passionate about fighting those teachings.

((Hugs))

Striving4Grace, I really can understand why you enjoy learning from your pastor and why you attend that church. Tedd Tripp is Reformed Baptist as I recall, and as someone who attended a Reformed Baptist church for 8 years (until we left two years ago), I can understand being drawn to attend that church. I trust that God will continue to guide you on this journey.

Kathy, I really think you are right when you say that Tedd Tripp "may grow, change, or become more nuanced in his ideas of how grace and truth can be applied to parenting."

Reformed Christians tend to talk a *lot* about God's grace and, I personally believe, tend to understand a lot of good things about God's grace. Yet in many cases, and I see this being true of much of evangelical Christianity in general, too, it seems that somehow they don't seem to grasp ways it should apply to parenting our children. But there are those who do apply it beautifully, and it sounds like he may be learning and understanding more about how grace applies to parenting. That is my prayer.

i also understand this must be a most difficult transition for you. i just want to encourage you to remember to test everything you hear and learn agains the authority of scripture. its so difficult to sort out the "good from the bad".

I think this is good advice. It's good for me, too, and I think for all of us to remember.