Re: Talk to me about Vision Forum
 

ProudHoohWife, I'm not sure what you're referring to being said that is scary, especially since you say you didn't read the entire thread. If you could give specific examples of your concerns, I'm sure we would be happy to address them.

I personally grew up under teachers like Doug Phillips and others discussed here in the patriarchy movement (this thread did turn into a more general discussion of the Patriarchy Movement rather than strictly Vision Forum alone).

I later found out that my parents didn't actually agree with all of the teachings, but with all the books and seminars and sermons we sat under, the teachings became pretty strongly embedded in me as a young girl.

As a teen and young adult, I used to go around proudly telling my friends that I was literally "a personal possession of my father's, to do with as he chooses" and that if my father wanted to give me a say in whether, when and whom I married that would be nice, but wasn't really necessary. I was his possession and he could transfer ownership to whoever he chose as my husband whether I would have chosen that or not.

The only thing I believed I was not required to obey him in was if he ordered me to do something that would be clearly sin. Some teachers in the Patriarchy movement even taught that even in that case we must submit and not worry about being held accountable by God for our sin, because even if it was sin our father/husband would be the one held accountable for that--the only thing we would be held accountable for was whether we obeyed our human authority or not.

I personally heard Sarah Faith Schlissel (daughter of one of the prominent Patriarchy Movement proponents) give a speech that sums up very well what is taught within the Patriarchy Movement about the authority of fathers. I think she was 18 when I heard her give this talk, and you can see the full text of the entire speech here: http://www. bibletopics.com/biblestudy/92b.htm

Some relevant excerpts:

I gave her a standing ovation. I was probably 17 at the time--I think she's about a year older than I am.

These Patriarchy Movement teachers actively teach that a husband/father is the "high priest of his home" (in those exact words), that children, wives and adult daughters are literally personal possessions of the husband/father, that submitting means they have NO desires/dreams/goals or even thoughts that do not further their husband/father's glory and agree completely with his, that if a woman or child wants to know what God wants to communicate to her all she needs to do is ask her dad/husband (seeking to hear God's voice for herself independently from her husband/father is strongly discouraged and taught to be sinful rebellion if it would differ from her husband/father's opinion in any way) and that any woman who does something as evil as going to college or working outside the home (even under her husband's leadership and in submission to him) is outside of God's will at best and an enemy of Christianity at worst.

It has the very real effect of making the father/husband a spiritual mediator between God and his wife/children, contrary to the doctrine of the priesthood of all believers and the teaching that each person has the ability to approach and hear from God directly for themselves. I truly believe that it is putting the father/husband in the place that rightly belongs only to God. I believe it is distinctly unbiblical and unhealthy.

Incidentally, it also placed a huge burden on my poor father, who didn't even attend most of the seminars or read most of the books, but could no longer make a suggestion or voice an opinion, no matter how minor, without it being taken as a command directly from God.

As a believer I have a responsibility to speak out against false doctrine and spiritual abuse when I am aware of it, especially when it is something I have personal experience of.

There are factually-based criticisms of doctrine that is actually being taught, and links to the quotes in full context, given throughout this thread. If you have concerns about what is being said, I would encourage you to explore further and read the evidence.

I am not just taking out of context things I have read on the internet. I grew up under these teachings and lived them.