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*Public*
(http://www.gentlechristianmothers.com/community/forumdisplay.php?f=421)
Re: Pearl's "plant your tree in the midst of the garden"
Completely goofy to draw a parenting application from the Tree of Good and Evil in the Garden of Eden. Reminds me of Gary Ezzo drawing a parenting application from the crucifixion.
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Re: Pearl's "plant your tree in the midst of the garden"
I don't believe that God purposefully sets us up to fail, but He does give us freedom to CHOOSE. There WILL be times in life when we are tempted, but it's NOT our job to put those temptations there for others. God doesn't do that, it's our sinful nature that causes those situations. Think about the people who tempt us to sin...prostitutes, drug dealers, criminals...I do not want to be likened to them! I want to truly LOVE my children as commanded in 1 Cor. and ...'not rejoice in wrong doing'.
I parent the way God parents me. Absolutely. However, I DO NOT equate myself TO God, the way the Pearls do. I don't need to set up situations to tempt my children. God can handle any situation my children will be in, I don't need to interfere and create some fake, arbitrary scenario. My job, as a Christian parent is to love God, and teach (not beat) my children about Him. I lead them to the bible, and God does the rest. I lead my life as closely to Christ as I possibly can, knowing that His grace and sacrifice covers all my mistakes and short comings. God is ALL about relationship. The obedience comes as a result of that relationship. :heart God does not set us up to fail, in fact He does everything He can (short of taking away our free will to choose) to help us follow Him. Every single one of His commands is for our GOOD, not for His convenience, like the Pearls suggest doing with our children. Children are commanded to obey their parents "IN THE LORD" NOT unquestioning, unfailing, first time obedience. And thank God! For I am as much a human as they are, and I make just as many if not more mistakes than they do. :pray4 I'm sorry this has caused you so much grief. I totally understand how it can cause doubt and agree that the Pearls are truly evil and twisting scripture. I pray that their eyes are opened. I pray that they experience God in all His majesty, His glory, and His mercy, so that they can see that parenting doesn't have to be so cruel. :cry Jesus paid the penalty. For everything. And EVERYone. Young and old. There is NO reason to punish, tempt or hurt our children. :hugheart |
Re: Pearl's "plant your tree in the midst of the garden"
BTW, there are at least a few Messianic teachers that absolutely do NOT believe that G-d planted the tree of good and evil in the garden, but rather that is was actually planted by the enemy.
If you read the actual text it says: Quote:
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I can't get to blb.org right now for some reason...so I can't actually look at the Hebrew to verify those 2 translations. BUT, the theory is that the creation scripture, along with the following 2 statements...as well as what we know about the character of G-d...give enough doubt as to whether HE planted the tree...or whether He simply left it there. B) in another passage, it says that whatever G-d plants, He does not root up (I haven't looked this up yet...it was quoted in the video I saw, but I can't remember where in Scripture He quoted it from) And, at the end of time...we see passages referring to the tree of life still being planted...but no mention of the other. So, while it is not CLEAR that G-d or someone else planted the tree of good and evil...there is at least enough evidence to suggest that in fact, it might not have been G-d. Anyway...just throwing this out there to give you something to consider...I haven't come to a conclusion on it one way or another yet...b/c it doesn't matter in the least to me re:how I parent or who G-d is. :shrug ETA: I realize this sounds really wacky (and it may very well be...like I said, I haven't delved into it)...I thought so too when I first heard about it, but it at least gets me :think about everything, which I think is a good thing. :yes |
Re: Pearl's "plant your tree in the midst of the garden"
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A trash can has a purpose and *also* MAY be a temptation for a child to get into. A trash can placed in the middle of the living room for the *sole purpose* of enticing a child to touch it and then hitting them is not the same thing. |
Re: Pearl's "plant your tree in the midst of the garden"
..."and then he sent his only begotten son, so that whosoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life"
The garden is not where the story ends. God did not put the tree in the garden to tempt adam and eve, for it is written: "When tempted, no one should say, “God is tempting me.” For God cannot be tempted by evil, nor does he tempt anyone; 14but each one is tempted when, by his own evil desire, he is dragged away and enticed." (James 1:13-14) The tree was put in the garden, in the midst of a garden overflowing with goodness, safety and ease, in order that man might have free choice. You don't need to worry about providing free choice for your child, God already has. There are plenty of options for a child to make choices on a day to day basis. Be a faithful steward of your beloved child. I recommend this article on discipline, by a woman who previously used the Pearl's methods: http://parentingfreedom.com/discipline/ BTW I believe in having boundaries around the house within reason. I think the younger the child is, you should create an environment where you aren't constantly having to redirect. I also believe in allowing natural consequences within reason so that a child will learn without parental intervention. |
Re: Pearl's "plant your tree in the midst of the garden"
That whole sentence doesn't even make sense to me b/c that chapter of Genesis is full of symbolism - I don't believe it's a literal play-by-play newsreel of what happened. In addition, I think that Michael Pearl is assuming he really knows God's intents and purposes behind his actions. Maybe saying the tree was in the middle of the garden has an entirely different meaning in ancient cultures :shrug.
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Re: Pearl's "plant your tree in the midst of the garden"
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To me he fully illustrates the scripture : Quote:
Every time his quotes come to mind, treat them as you would any intrusive thought from the enemy - quote Scripture, sing a praise song, think on God. :heart :pray4 |
Re: Pearl's "plant your tree in the midst of the garden"
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Re: Pearl's "plant your tree in the midst of the garden"
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I had a friend give me all 4 of his books when I was 9 weeks postpartum :sick Reading them - really truly reading them - was one of the things God used to push me toward GBD. God can use even evil books for good. But I don't suggest going that route :shiver because there are things in there that, like you, I wish I could un-read. Praying you are able to wash your mind in the Word today :pray4 |
Re: Pearl's "plant your tree in the midst of the garden"
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Re: Pearl's "plant your tree in the midst of the garden"
Another thought...note that God removed them from the garden after they ate from the tree. The Pearls would have us continually placing the temptation in front of the kids, hitting them on multiple occassions until they learn fear. But God just removed Adam and Eve from that location after they made a poor choice. Like the pp said, there's no sudden painful bolt of lightening, etc., just a consequence and removal. A big consequence, but not a physical beating, not a repetative consequence, just one matter-of-fact consequence later redeemed by our Saviour.
If we really want to stretch for a parenting metaphor, I think that verse gives me permission to put things up after I notice the temptation being too great. But really it's just out of context in general. |
Re: Pearl's "plant your tree in the midst of the garden"
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I don't think God put it there to tempt them - I think it served another purpose. I don't know what, but I agree that He didn't just plant it, or as mentioned before allow it to be there, just for the sole purpose of temptation. I am NOT agreeing with the Pearl's on this - I think they are WAY off base and do twist scripture and have a sadistic view of God, themselves, and children. It's sad. :cry I'm just saying I don't think that we should remove every thing out of our children's path because God didn't remove everything from our path, even if it is tempting. I am not saying *put* something there for the sole purpose of tempting. :) |
Re: Pearl's "plant your tree in the midst of the garden"
oh dear...these people are crazy :crazy2 . due to all the media attention, i checked out their website in case somone i know is interested in their methods. i'm speechless :jawdrop .
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Re: Pearl's "plant your tree in the midst of the garden"
Hmmm... I think the meaning of the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil has something to do with this. Adam and Eve had the choice between leaning on God and His guidance and leaning on their own understanding to discern (or attempt to discern!) good from evil. That's hardly the same thing as leaving a no-no within reach just for the sake of teaching them to obey.
Emma |
Re: Pearl's "plant your tree in the midst of the garden"
bbl
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