Bill Gothard
 

Could someone please explain to me why this man has so much influence in many Christian circles? I did a google search on him last night, howbeit briefly. The man is not even married and has no children, yet he pretends to tell people how to raise their children and how to act in their marriages and people listen to him. I tried looking at his website, and it appears that he doesn't tell anything for free, you have to pay to read his ideas. What is the attraction of this man? He seems to be pretty looked down upon in the blog world and it seems that there is quite a bit of controversy and scandal surrounding him. FWIW, I grew up in a non religious mainstream punitive home so I never even heard of this guy (or Pearl or Ezzo) until I joined message boards. I just don't get it.

Re: Bill Gothard
 

I would love to know the appeal also. :shrug

Perhaps it is because some people really want a nice, simple, guaranteed version of child parenting. Most psychologists make no claim that they have the absolute right way to rear all children, but The Pearls, Ezzo and Gothard all claim that they know the one way to parent every child.

Re: Bill Gothard
 

Well, you can hear him here. This would be day 1 of his basic seminar, where he speaks of wisdom. (link broken) http:// iblp.org/iblp/seminars/basic/online/
He attests that you can get the answer to anything from the Bible. . . . . not personal experience. That most mistakes are made because people listen to other people, not going to the Bible for answers. So, really, him *not* having a wife and/or kids is actually helpful in this regard, because it doesn't distract from what the Bible really says about the situation(s). That's basically what it is.

Re: Bill Gothard
 

:hunh He's not married and has no children? I had no idea, not that I've ever researched him or anything. I just know he's considered to be a huge expert on families. I'm shocked that some of the high profile large families would regard him as an expert when they probably know 100 times more than he does about the subject. :scratch

I see the reasoning of going to the Bible instead of personal experience for answers, BUT don't Gothardites believe that marriage and children are a Biblical imperative? :think

Re: Bill Gothard
 

There are cult-like dynamics at work. Plus he's a good marketer.

I watched the video for a little bit....you can see how he works at getting the "buy in" from viewers by starting from a biblical principle that is self evident (that God's point of view would represent true wisdom, and man's point of view is limited) and then reminding people of the various distressing things in their lives that they wish could be avoided or solved. And then the hope is drawn....if you had God's point of view, you could solve it.

Next up, how God's point of view is embodied in the scriptures, which by following, we'll be able to solve our conflicts and problems and keep conflicts and problems out of our children's lives, too.

Except it turns out that Gothard's use of scripture involves legalistic, twisted and weird applications.

Re: Bill Gothard
 

I will admit that I have always been confused by people who claim that the Bible can guide us in every part of our lives. The Bible doesn't tell me such things as how to schedule a newborn's feeding-or if I should-, or what battles with my kids are importatant to fight and when I should just let go. KWIM?

So, why do the Pearl's, Gothard, etc claim that the Bible can be used to basically micromanage how people parent?

Re: Bill Gothard
 

Because of the Biblical principles. For instance, you schedule a baby's feeding, because God is a God of order, God created bodies to work a certain way, and scheduling feeding (or just plain schedules) is how the body and mind work most efficiently. God set it up that way, so it is best that way, and this is the "proof" that it is best that way. That is the reasoning. The "battles" to fight with the kids are set by scripture the same way. . . . you want, say, the children to obey. Immediately and without question, which is the way the Lord expects us to act. So, that is the way we are to "train" them. So, pick the "battles" that have a principle behind it. That is the reasoning. The Bible has the answer for *everything*. . . just find the principle behind it.

Re: Bill Gothard
 

our mission organization required us to go to 2 bill gothard seminars (as a team). after i was able to recognize our mission as being spiritually controlling and toxic, i then was able to see how Bill Gothard's teachings are toxic.

he presents everything as "7 steps to forgiveness" "10 steps to ________" as if everything has a formula. i think the one teaching that bothered me the most (because i bought into it) is that all anger is a result of not "giving up your rights". this was a big teaching at our missionary base as well (to the point of using that phrase manipulatively). it brought an awful lot of guilt and condemnation into my life. My pastor recently gave a sermon, and i love the way he spoke about anger. B.G. made it sound like if i'm angry, i'm doing something wrong. i should give up my right to __________. My pastor talked about how, many times, we may feel angry because of a difference in values that 2 people have. which makes more sense to me. it doesn't mean that one is right and one is wrong, it just means that you hold different importance on different issues, and so you find a way to reconcile that, either with changing your expectations of someone else, or accepting the differences, or working it thru. you get the picture. I think B.G. puts too much emphasis on things being a 'sin issue' when that's not necessarily the case. :no2

Re: Bill Gothard
 

Right, Susie. Everything comes down to anger. And no Christian has "rights". *Everything* we have and are belong to God, and, therefore, we do not have the right to even be angry. Because God is in control of everything. So, we have to give up our rights. We don't have the right to, say, happiness. The right bestow happiness is God's. Therefore, if we are upset because of something that is wrong, that is making us unhappy, we are claiming a "right" we do not have. We are not entitled to *anything*, but, by His grace, God gives us everything. . . . everything He deems that we need and want. So, we should be happy. That's kind of the gist, if that makes any sense.

Re: Bill Gothard
 

Well, its not only some Christain circles that embrace all things Gothard. Ya know the CharacterFirst or Character Counts training in most public schools? It originated with Gothard. The five "pillars" and all that thing.

Not saying character is a bad thing, but like Ezzo, he has a secular version and a Christian version. I simply don't believe that something I pay tax dollars for and is controlled by the government should be given power and authority to mold my kid's morality. Ya know?

He says his Character First program is not religious. I don't think you can have ANY program which focuses on morals and it NOT be religious. "Universal Truths"????? I mean, even atheists in the end, worship something...they just don't realize it.

Blessings,
Trishy

Re: Bill Gothard
 

So, do people who follow Gothard's teaching believe that there is no such thing as righteous anger? :scratch Getting angry that there are wrongs in the world can inspire people to try and fix those wrongs.

Their line of reasoning sounds like it could lead some of their followers to rationalize being in controlling, abusive relationships.

Re: Bill Gothard
 

[quote=debf ]
So, do people who follow Gothard's teaching believe that there is no such thing as righteous anger? :scratch Getting angry that there are wrongs in the world can inspire people to try and fix those wrongs. Which Bible verses do they use to say that all anger is wrong? I can think of so many instances when my anger helped motivate me to change a situation that needed to be changed in my life.

Their line of reasoning sounds like it could lead some of their followers to rationalize being in controlling, abusive relationships.

Sorry to ask so many questions in another poster's thread. :O

Re: Bill Gothard
 

I've read about him and I'm actually confused myself about what the appeal is :shrug. Maybe it's for the same reason the other Christian punitive parenting authors/teachers are so popular, because the answers they provide seem very clear cut and simple.

Re: Bill Gothard
 

I'd never heard of him until I saw his name mentioned here in connection w/ the Duggars. Is he really that influential? :scratch

Re: Bill Gothard
 

Many of the families that use him don't advocate for him the way Ezzo's followers do. You begin to realize that "oh wow, that's a Gothard family" only after you get up close and personal with the weirdness. Very fundamentalist homeschoolers are almost always Gothard families.