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-   Unprepared for Parenting (Ezzos, Pearls, Etc.) *Public* (http://www.gentlechristianmothers.com/community/forumdisplay.php?f=421)
-   -   Salon Article on Pearls (http://www.gentlechristianmothers.com/community/showthread.php?t=160163)

raisa 05-25-2006 11:36 AM

Salon Article on Pearls
 
Salon.com has published its article about the Pearls . . . apologies if this has been linked elsewhere on GCM today (feel free to move)

Spare the quarter-inch plumbing supply line, spoil the child
http://www. salon.com/mwt/feature/2006/05/25/the_pearls/index_np.html

Edited to add: I just made my way through it to see that they quoted Jeri and linked to GCM!! Wow!!




happy2bmama 05-25-2006 12:01 PM

Re: Salon Article on Pearls
 
OH BUMMER! You have to pay to read the article?

BeckaBlue 05-25-2006 12:11 PM

Re: Salon Article on Pearls
 
there's a visa logo you can click on to read the whole thing free :)

Punkie 05-25-2006 01:20 PM

Re: Salon Article on Pearls
 
Quote:

"It's a little swat on the back of the hand that says, 'Don't touch that,' or a swat on the back of the calf that says, 'Stop crying, buck up, be a happy girl.'
:hunh Maybe she needs to read VanVonderen about supressing anger...

DebraBaker 05-25-2006 01:48 PM

Re: Salon Article on Pearls
 
It's chilling to read people's responses.

So many people with similar horror story childhoods.

So many people who are closed to the Gospel because they were beaten in the name of Jesus.

Debra Baker

Irene 05-25-2006 01:50 PM

Re: Salon Article on Pearls
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by punkie
Quote:

"It's a little swat on the back of the hand that says, 'Don't touch that,' or a swat on the back of the calf that says, 'Stop crying, buck up, be a happy girl.'
:hunh Maybe she needs to read VanVonderen about supressing anger...

that quote stood out to me as well... :(

great job Meggan and Jeri :tu :hug

hsgbdmama 05-25-2006 03:58 PM

Re: Salon Article on Pearls
 
:highfive :tu Another good article, with good links, so readers unfamiliar with these methods can see that there are places that actually sell these "implements." :cry2

hey mommy 05-25-2006 05:32 PM

Re: Salon Article on Pearls
 
Quote:

." Judge and her husband followed the Pearls' advice when trying to train their infant son Noah not to grab forbidden objects: "Switch their hand once and simultaneously say, 'No.' Remember, you are not disciplining, you are training. One spat with a little switch is enough," reads the book. "They will again pull back their hand and consider the relationship between the object, their desire, the command and the little reinforcing pain. It may take several times, but if you are consistent, they will learn to consistently obey, even in your absence."
Interesting(in a horrid way).. I did that by teaching DS from a very early age "these are pretties. We don't touch, we only look" about everything and now he asks "is it a pretty?" and if I say yes, he doesn't touch. Sad that they think you have to smack their hands to get the point across.. I did that once w/DS when he was 7 months old and felt like crud for it. He wouldn't leave the electrical outlet alone at my MIL's, and no amount of diversion or moving him away would stop him. He just went right back. It was the first time I ever smacked his hand(possibly the only). It worked, but I felt terrible for it and I know he did too.. :(


I remember my cousin holding her Ds, who was under 8 months old at the time, and trying to get him to sleep(though he wasn't tired, she just didn't want us playing w/him b/c she didn't/doesn't like us) and she was holding him towards her telling him "get on your knees' over and over and when he wouldn't bend his knees, she smacked his legs really hard. Didn't work. Just made him mad instead. So then she grabbed his legs and bent his knees herself, which I'm sure wasn't good for his little bitty knees.. I felt so bad for the poor guy.. I was ready to smack HER for it and see how she liked it!

Quote:

udge had to lock Noah in a separate room for fear she would "beat him senseless," she says. "I just wanted to know when that 'peace' the Pearls talk about was going to come."
Umm, well, if you are beating your child, it's NOT going to come!!!

hsgbdmama 05-25-2006 05:37 PM

Re: Salon Article on Pearls
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by mommy2cias
Quote:

." Judge and her husband followed the Pearls' advice when trying to train their infant son Noah not to grab forbidden objects: "Switch their hand once and simultaneously say, 'No.' Remember, you are not disciplining, you are training. One spat with a little switch is enough," reads the book. "They will again pull back their hand and consider the relationship between the object, their desire, the command and the little reinforcing pain. It may take several times, but if you are consistent, they will learn to consistently obey, even in your absence."
Interesting(in a horrid way).. I did that by teaching DS from a very early age "these are pretties. We don't touch, we only look" about everything and now he asks "is it a pretty?" and if I say yes, he doesn't touch. Sad that they think you have to smack their hands to get the point across.. I did that once w/DS when he was 7 months old and felt like crud for it. He wouldn't leave the electrical outlet alone at my MIL's, and no amount of diversion or moving him away would stop him. He just went right back. It was the first time I ever smacked his hand(possibly the only). It worked, but I felt terrible for it and I know he did too.. :(


I remember my cousin holding her Ds, who was under 8 months old at the time, and trying to get him to sleep(though he wasn't tired, she just didn't want us playing w/him b/c she didn't/doesn't like us) and she was holding him towards her telling him "get on your knees' over and over and when he wouldn't bend his knees, she smacked his legs really hard. Didn't work. Just made him mad instead. So then she grabbed his legs and bent his knees herself, which I'm sure wasn't good for his little bitty knees.. I felt so bad for the poor guy.. I was ready to smack HER for it and see how she liked it!

Quote:

udge had to lock Noah in a separate room for fear she would "beat him senseless," she says. "I just wanted to know when that 'peace' the Pearls talk about was going to come."
Umm, well, if you are beating your child, it's NOT going to come!!!

Just a gentle FYI -- Meggan is one of our wonderful mamas who stepped forward to tell her story ... she has been saved from these horrid methods. :praise

hey mommy 05-25-2006 05:40 PM

Re: Salon Article on Pearls
 
OH, I wasn't saing anything bad about HER!!! I was just commenting ont he Pearl method... I'm glad to hear she has been 'reformed'. :)

RubySlippers 05-25-2006 09:40 PM

Re: Salon Article on Pearls
 
Thanks for the link. :popcorn

DebraBaker 05-26-2006 06:43 AM

Re: Salon Article on Pearls
 
I think we have quite a few moms here who were negatively effected by the parenting gurus that prey upon the good intentions of young parents.

It's amazing to me to read some of their stories.

Thanks for the reminder.


callasandra 05-27-2006 05:00 PM

Re: Salon Article on Pearls
 
Wow, when you read the article on the Pearls and then click on the blog Doc's Sunrise Rants we Christians really have a bad reputation. Kinda scary, makes trying to witness about the love of Christ so much harder when people view us as lunatics who abuse children. Where do these people come off saying that they are training their children the way God trains us?

Callasandra

TulipMama 05-27-2006 08:50 PM

Re: Salon Article on Pearls
 
I thought what Jeri said was beautiful. . .

Quote:

"I believe that Christian parents from both approaches love their children deeply and have a heart's desire to follow God and to raise their children for His glory, and I have no desire to create further division in the Christian parenting community," says Jeri Carr, 35, a home-schooling mother of four in Washington state. Initially, however, Carr had trouble finding a place there for herself. She founded the Web site Gentle Christian Mothers nine years ago after determining that other Christian parenting resources ran counter to her "God-given mothering intuition." There was no Christian support for many of the "gentle parenting choices," such as feeding in response to hunger, as opposed to on a schedule, that she believed in, she says. "I felt very alone. "

Then Carr came across a technique called attachment parenting, a "secular" style promoted by other Christian parenting Web sites such as Arms of Love Family Fellowship. "I began mothering my little one more responsively and from the heart, making more gentle choices," she says. "I had always planned on spanking my children, but I began to realize that I didn't have to spank in order to please God, and God led my husband and me to discipline our children without spanking them."

But what about all those verses in Proverbs? "The 'rod,' or staff, our Shepherd holds is one that He uses to comfort us, guide us, lead us, protect us," Carr says. "As Christian parents we desire to show God to our children through our relationship with them, a God who is loving and gracious, who is always there for us and who answers our cries and treats us with gentleness and kindness."

Gentle Christian Mothers has also become, in part, a support community for mothers like Meggan Judge, who was at first convinced that Noah's recalcitrance was entirely her fault. "They tell us that if parents would only spank 'correctly,' parents will get the results -- the first-time, happy obedience -- that they desire," says Carr. "When it doesn't 'work' parents can end up feeling very guilty and worried that they are doing it wrong and are failing to do it the biblical way. They may worry that they'll wind up with out-of-control children, so they try harder to do it 'right,' and the battle continues. Children may end up bitter and angry, and deeply hurt, with a warped picture in their mind of who our gracious God truly is."

(This is from page four of the Salon.Com article. . .)

nutmeggmama 05-27-2006 10:21 PM

Re: Salon Article on Pearls
 
jeri, your words were beautiful!

Danette 05-28-2006 11:20 AM

Re: Salon Article on Pearls
 
Meggan your story is powerful as well and it echos my experience. :hug It's comforting to know that I'm not the only one who has been through this. I've also found that through telling my story that it brings some mom's to start asking questions and evaluating their parenting style and hopefully when they are ready they can find a more gracious and gentle way to deal with their children as we have. :hug

Praying that this report will stir more discussions and bring many mom's to evaluate and to search the scriptures for the way God would have them raise their children and not a man who claims to know what God wants parents to do. :pray

Irene 05-28-2006 08:39 PM

Re: Salon Article on Pearls
 
I agree Danette, and I also think that some moms have these same feelings, but go back to the book or talk to others and just thing "gee, if I just keep it up, he promises peace in my home" and always think they are alone in those feelings. Hearing or reading that someone else had those feelings and were able to get out of it, might really help some closet struggling moms.

I remember when a lady called me on the phone and was just telling me in such a nice calm, non judging way her Ezzo experience and "if you feel its not working for you, dont feel guilty" sort of thing... wow that meant so much to me that someone else struggled with it, instead of the rosy perfect picturesque families that you see everywhere.

anyway, I just wanted to say, Meggan, that your story reminded me of that and I think that there are moms out there that will really benefit from your story, I know it took a lot of courage :hug

mommylinn 05-28-2006 10:40 PM

Re: Salon Article on Pearls
 
Rebekah's testimony of her upbring was really interesting, and especially how they are raising their own children. If what she describes is true, then her own parents were not 100% consistent in their methods, instead they were really creative, and she said she and her dh use 90% of the times more creative means. Hmmm, sounds like she was actually raised in a positive parenting home that occasionally used spankings, and uses positive parenting herself. If the Pearl's didn't use it themselves, but instead used very creative positive means to raise their kids, they why did they not write a book about that? I'd sure like to read some creative and humourus responses to our kids behaviour :grin . Instead it seems they wrote a book advocating 100% compliance to a single method. And she thinks that only those who were traumatised are opposed to their method? By her own words, she and her Dh are in reality opposed to them; and she is a self proclaimed balanced happily adjusted person. I'm sure she is, but my point is, that the extended Pearl family do not seem to see what people really have a problem with, because their own happy childhood is blinding them to what TTUAC actually teaches.

Rachel

RubySlippers 05-29-2006 10:55 PM

Re: Salon Article on Pearls
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by mommylinn
If the Pearl's didn't use it themselves, but instead used very creative positive means to raise their kids, they why did they not write a book about that? I'd sure like to read some creative and humourus responses to our kids behaviour :grin . Instead it seems they wrote a book advocating 100% compliance to a single method.

And many of their followers only get this one method from the book. They point to the Pearl's children as proof that spanking/switching works. I've heard Pearl advocates consistently respond to parenting questions with "spanking" as the method of discipline while continually going back to the Proverbs as 'proof'. No creativity there. I've even heard some say that if spanking doesn't "work", keep doing it, because even if you don't see it work, it is God's will and you should be faithful because you don't know the outcome in the future (when it's supposedly going to work). :sick2

hsgbdmama 05-30-2006 04:48 AM

Re: Salon Article on Pearls
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by calmom
I've even heard some say that if spanking doesn't "work", keep doing it, because even if you don't see it work, it is God's will and you should be faithful because you don't know the outcome in the future (when it's supposedly going to work). :sick2

Or to "spank harder," "spank 'em like ya really mean it," start using implements (i.e., wooden spoons/paddles) or switch to a bigger/harder implement. :sick2 :sick2 :sick2 :bheart :bheart :bheart

Danette 05-30-2006 06:13 AM

Re: Salon Article on Pearls
 
Quote:

And many of their followers only get this one method from the book.
That was me. :cry I could read a whole parenting book that gave lots of great suggestions but if it had one sentence in it about spanking that's all I would hold on to. :rolleyes Why is that?? I guess because it was something I could do without planning ahead or coming up with an idea on the spot. I think it gave me a sense of control when I was feeling out of control. :think I spanked to get a reaction out of my child that was equal to the reaction I was having over their misbehavior. :(

Ok... I'm off to go hug and kiss on my kids... I'll let you know how many times they roll their eyes. :lol

hey mommy 05-30-2006 07:37 AM

Re: Salon Article on Pearls
 
Yep, my own sister told me that I wasn't spanking DS hard enough. I told her one day about ds doing something and she said "welll, spank him". I said "I did, it didn't do any good". She said "well, then you didn't spank him hard enough".. What????? Good Grief.. She's really gonna flip next month when she discovers I no longer spank AT ALL... And, no, she isn't a Pearl follower...

Wholly Mama 05-30-2006 04:05 PM

Re: Salon Article on Pearls
 
185 letters later....
I've come away from the letters section a bit shell-shocked. It's sad to me that it's such a divisive issue. I, too, love what Jeri had to say. After years of striving toward gentle parenting and going through "anti-whoever" phases, I've come to a peace over my parenting. I don't need to bash anyone else in order to be a good parent. I think that Pearl followers are not evil people, just perhaps misled.
It was hard reading all of those Christian bashing letters. It was hard to see over and over again the spanked child vs. the wild child, as if those are the only two options. Why is it that Americans still believe that spanking is the only means of enforcing a boundary?
My issue with the Pearls is not necessarily their child training ways, but their skewed theology which places fathers/Michael Pearl in a god-like status, who is able to train the sin out of his children.
:hug Meggan. I am so proud of you. You have been so brave to come forward with these two articles. I love you, sister!

TulipMama 05-30-2006 04:11 PM

Re: Salon Article on Pearls
 
Quote:

I've even heard some say that if spanking doesn't "work", keep doing it, because even if you don't see it work, it is God's will and you should be faithful because you don't know the outcome in the future (when it's supposedly going to work).
*nods*

And I find this disturbing. I do believe we can trust God, even when we don't understand. But following a "command" based on weak translation of one section of Scripture, when it is at odds with the rest of God's special revelation and at odds with what we see in God's creation? Very disturbing.


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