Re: Talk to me about Vision Forum
 

The Botkin situation makes me kind of sad. I actually watched their movie before I found gcm and learned about mutual submission and what being a woman of God actually means. Anywho, those two girls are beautiful, intelligent, talented, etc., and their dad really just creeps me out.

I don't have a problem with daughters staying home if that's what they want. God forbid my child should ever live in a dorm! But I also want them to have their own life, away from me. To me that is healthy.

Re: Talk to me about Vision Forum
 

Yup, the torch DOES get passed on to a brother. And then, if the girl ever did get married, I assume he would give her away at the wedding instead of the Father - or sorry, I didn't mean wedding, I meant "transfer of authority."

And whoever said that home business were the ideal were right - that is the Biblical way to do thing, doncha know? :)

Re: Talk to me about Vision Forum
 

I've read the Botkin sisters' blog - they are amazingly talented, and paint such a compelling picture of the patriocentric life - I can see the appeal. The ideal seems to be that, as men are intrinsically stronger than women, a woman under male authority can still be as strong as she is capable of being - which is pretty darn strong, looking at the Botkin sisters and some of their email correspondents - without having to worry about overshadowing her male authority. They paint a picture of using one's gifts to their fullest - no doormats or wilting violets there! - but in service to those closest to them, instead of a random boss. With a male leader who is confident in his leadership and so has no need to bring others down in a petty attempt to boost himself up - but instead raises up those around him. While I can't get over the theoretical framework, the vision of the practical outworking presented *does* sound wonderful :shrug.

Shame it doesn't work out like that in practice :sigh. But inevitable, given human nature - power corrupts, and absolute power corrupts absolutely :shrug.

Re: Talk to me about Vision Forum
 

:thinksubbing

Re: Talk to me about Vision Forum
 

According to VF then, we're toast. :shifty Not only is my DH employed outside the home, but he's a public school teacher, and at least one of his boys has voiced a desire to follow in his footsteps. :giggle

Re: Talk to me about Vision Forum
 

O/T, see bolded. Some of the best years of my life were lived in a dorm. They were also at a point where my faith was probably at its strongest. Dorms do not have to be evil incarnate. :shrug3

Re: Talk to me about Vision Forum
 

You all fail in far bigger ways than Brandons job. I believe you wear pants.

Re: Talk to me about Vision Forum
 

One of the things that I find really "off" about the Botkins is, where in the Bible is it written: "Let the teenaged/twenty-something daughters tell the rest of the women on earth how to live our lives"??:no
And yet they do!!

Re: Talk to me about Vision Forum
 

They are major leaders in the patriarchal movement.

Read the page on their website on "Beautiful Girlhood" and you will see many statements along the line of, and In the doctrinal statement on their website (visionforum.org) titled "The Tenets of Biblical Patriarchy," they make it pretty clear that they elevate things like homeschooling and not allowing your children to go to age-segregated Sunday School to the level of spiritual absolutes (i.e. going beyond a recommendation to the level of calling/implying it is a sin not to do as they suggest).

VF is also dominionist/reconstructionist, if that bothers you:

They are Quiver-full (believing it's a sin to try to limit or control the number of children God gives).

www. visionforum.com/news/blogs/doug/2004/02/662/


Here's a blog talking a bit about Vision Forum:

http://www.yehaveheard.com/tag/vision-forum/

Re: Talk to me about Vision Forum
 

I didn't know 'Beautiful Girlhood' was from Vision Forum!! I've read that book growing up and I thought it was wonderful and still do! I think in most things there is some truth to everything. This book may just be the 'kernel' of good within the whole sphere of VF thinking. :shrug3 I havent read too many other things from them. I might explore it in greater detail for myself before jumping to any conclusions (good or bad). I can tell from all the posts that there are definitely aspects to VF that I also disagree with, but maybe there is some good too.

Re: Talk to me about Vision Forum
 

t

Re: Talk to me about Vision Forum
 

I never got that impression when I read it growing up. The book merely encouraged the desires I already had - to be a modest, godly housewife and mother. I guess I dismissed the negative aspects of the book subconciously. Now that I am a wife/mother, I should pull the book out again (if I can find it up in the attic or among the storage boxes). Maybe I'll see it differently, maybe not.

Re: Talk to me about Vision Forum
 

n

Re: Talk to me about Vision Forum
 

Please be AWARE!!! The very fact that there is some good and some beauty intermingled with this poisonous teaching is the problem. It is attractive. Some of it is appealing.
In my opinion it is not worth sifting through the refuse to find a few nuggets of truth, when the truth is to be had from much purer sources.

Re: Talk to me about Vision Forum
 

The same exact same thing can be said of any the materials written by Ezzo.