Goldfish - New update p.50.. new fish

[MaySunflowers]

Can someone give me some dummy proof answers to my questions... we are getting 2 goldfish on Monday.

I haven't had fish in about 20 years....... I've already asked my fish expert friend... who confused me to no end... looked it up online and that gave me conflicting information....

What I have done so far. I have bought a tank and all needed stuff for it. I have set it up, put the stuff in the water to remove the nasties from the tap water and am going to run it for a few days before getting fish as the shop lady said would be best.

I know how to feed fish..... I know how to clean the tank but need some more specifics....

Do I clean the entire tank every time or remove and replace half the water and do the entire thing every second time?? I am reading conflicting stuff on this...

Also.... some websites say when cleaning to scrub down everything... others say not to thoroughly scrub down stuff as some of the fish goo is a good thing not a bad thing and that really only algae is bad as well as fish waste.... is that right? What do you do?

Is there some other thing I might be missing? I am good with temperatures, good distance away from direct light, have a lid to keep them from jumping out and kids from dropping things in..... anything else?

I have a feeling goldfish are simpler than they seem in my mind!!

wait new question!! I filled the tank with cold water today and we plan to get the fish monday.... will the water reach room temperature in that time or am I best off warming it up? My hubby says put the tank by the radiator for a bit! LOL

[Marrae]

I used to change all the water and scrub the tank out and clean the gravel with Dettox. The fish never lasted long. :bag I learned that wiping out the tank with paper towels and plain water and rinsing the gravel with plain water and using 1/3 old water to 2/3 fresh worked better.

[MaySunflowers]

Yes, I'm definately not using any cleaners! My husband said when he used to have fish his mom bleached the tank then refilled it and all the fish died.

I'm so not used to fish. I'm quite a cat/bird person... would have gotten a budgie instead but couldn't find anywhere that hand rears them AND feeds them a good diet.

[domesticzookeeper]

wait new question!! I filled the tank with cold water today and we plan to get the fish monday.... will the water reach room temperature in that time or am I best off warming it up? My hubby says put the tank by the radiator for a bit! LOL

Should be fine :yes Goldfish do okay in chillier water, at least compared to other fish. Just remember to feed them less if the water is cool, because their metabolism will be slower.

I have to say, though, goldfish are NOT low-maintenance fish :no At least not if you want them to last awhile ;)

BBL...

[MaySunflowers]

I hope we can manage to keep them alive for awhile!

I did want to consider some other cold water type fish but there isn't much sold near to where I am... so I thought we'd start with this and maybe if we have no luck with these (but hopefully it will be fine!) then we might try another type.

[domesticzookeeper]

If the goldfish don't work out, you might want to buy a little tank heater and try a single male Betta. IME, they're one of the hardiest fish, and most are very personable :)

AFA cleaning the tank, because goldfish are oh-so-unbelievably and incredibly dirty, you'll want to do it once a week. At least :shifty Don't worry about scrubbing, just change the water and be sure to get the gunk that settles in the gravel. And don't change the filter pads or anything, unless they get too gunked up to allow water through. Those pads will eventually grow a colony of beneficial bacteria that will help to keep the water clean :yes

[MaySunflowers]

I like the idea of a betta but, I have two kids and each wants a fish to call their own... and far as I know those kill each other don't they?

---------- Post added at 04:18 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:16 PM ----------

Oh and a friend of mine said to get a filter that sits at the bottom to suck up most of the gunk so I got one... I actually think its probably for a tank much bigger than mine as its the height of my whole tank!

My daughter took out a library book and it has some sort of squeeze vaccume thing in it for sucking bottom gunk out... I might look into finding one of those as they didn't have that at the pet shop.

[domesticzookeeper]

I like the idea of a betta but, I have two kids and each wants a fish to call their own... and far as I know those kill each other don't they?

Yes, they do :-/ Their biggest drawback.

But it sounds like you've got a good set-up going :rockon

[Tee]

I like the idea of a betta but, I have two kids and each wants a fish to call their own... and far as I know those kill each other don't they?

I have seen those wire separators that splits the tank in half so you can have 2 Betta's in one tank. Not sure if it works well or not but they do sell them.

[kiloyd]

Goldfish are very dirty fish.

And yes, they can have cold water. My parent's used o have goldfish in the horses' water trough in VA and the fish survived winter with sometimes ice on the top. Somone would break a hole in the ice.

I haven't had a tank in a loooong time. We did recently have a Betta in a one gallon bowl. He lived for 2 yrs. My son cleaned him every 2-3 weeks. A goldfish needs more often

What size tank do you have?

[MaySunflowers]

Well... we have two goldfish floating in the bag acclimating to the water temperature at the moment. Their names are Tiddles (my son named him after the Hamster in Peppa Pig) and Lady Googoo (named by my daughter after the Moshi Monster). Tiddles is orange with a black moustach and beard :giggle And Lady Googoo is white with orange hair and orange lipstick :lol

The pet shop man was really helpful and said to get the regular goldfish rather than the fancy tailed ones (that my daughter had her heart set on) as they are very sensitive to pH.

What makes goldfish dirty fish? Do they just produce more waste than other fish?

[domesticzookeeper]

Well... we have two goldfish floating in the bag acclimating to the water temperature at the moment. Their names are Tiddles (my son named him after the Hamster in Peppa Pig) and Lady Googoo (named by my daughter after the Moshi Monster). Tiddles is orange with a black moustach and beard :giggle And Lady Googoo is white with orange hair and orange lipstick :lol

:heart

The pet shop man was really helpful and said to get the regular goldfish rather than the fancy tailed ones (that my daughter had her heart set on) as they are very sensitive to pH.

The fancy tailed are definitely more delicated. Of course, the single-tailed grow to be twice as long and need more space :shifty But they are definitely hardier :yes


What makes goldfish dirty fish? Do they just produce more waste than other fish?

Part of it is their digestion: they're like the cows of the fish world :giggle They're really designed to be grazers (ours loved to eat the green algae in the tank), and so if allowed they will eat constantly and expel a lot of waste that isn't entirely digested, which raises the ammonia levels in the tank considerably. All fish produce ammonia as a by-product of eating and breathing, but goldfish do it so fast they actually poison their own water :shiver You can never, ever go wrong with frequent water changes ;)

[MaySunflowers]

I told my kids if we can manage to keep these ones alive and healthy for a good while we will see to getting a bigger tank and maybe adding more fish one day.

I found a good website full of tips for cleaning the tank. Finally a really simple explanation. They said to change 10% of the water each day to reduce amonia levels.

I had a thought that maybe I will get a big container and fill it with treated water the day before, then it can sit at room temperature and be ready for when I change the tank.

Our new fish seem quite happy so far. They are very lively and busy. They even seem to have personality... Tiddles always explores and Lady Googoo always follows behind.

[MaySunflowers]

UPDATE :(

After a few hours of absolutely nothing concerning, great lively fish... they up and died within about a 20 minute period. We are absolutely baffled. My daughter is quite upset and doesn't want any more fish.

We will call the pet store tomorrow and see what they have to say, if we can have a refund or get new ones.

Absolutely no idea what it could be so suddenly! The temperature was fine, not in sunlight, tank ran for a few days ahead of time... they were perfectly find for about 4 1/2 hours... then suddenly in about a 20 minute period we thought they were sleeping, even looked it up online for pictures and you tube videos.... then.... they just died!!

[deena]

:jawdrop :there

[MaySunflowers]

:jawdrop :there

I know!!

We have been googling like mad trying to work out an answer for what could have happened but every new thought we get turns out to not be it. We are completely baffled.

When I was young and got lousy fish and had no idea about treating the water first, those fish lasted longer than these!

[MomtoJGJ]

Ok... I have to disagree with everything everyone has said :shifty Here's what we do, and generally our fish survive... well, the ones who survive survived well ;) Like YEARS.

We fill our tank with tap water and no chems. We buy like 5 goldfish (generally the ones that ya'll are saying are delicate) and put them in the tank in the bag until someone remembers they are in there, then we let them out (a day or so later sometimes)

Then we don't clean the tank, don't put any chems in, feed them when someone remembers we have fish (once a week sometimes daily sometimes monthly :shifty), and add plain tap water whenever the water gets low. No filters, no light, no heater. Basically our tank is a 29 gallon fish bowl. When one dies we consider it food for the others :shifty

When we moved they lived for 6 months with nothing done with them and died when we actually fed them. Our last batch of them, 2 died instantly (like within a couple of hours of buying them), 2 lived a year, and one more lived two years.

So basically for us goldfish do much better if we don't try to do anything fancy with them and just pretty well forget about them.

[MaySunflowers]

I did read online that tap water can be used if its first left to sit for 48 hours, not sure why that long as it didn't say.

I'm hoping to get my money back tomorrow and either try a different pet shop or a different fish (which they don't sell at that shop).


And like you say about not doing what everyone said... a friend of mine got a fair fish... placed it in a tank with a filter, feed it and NEVER cleaned anything but the filter and only added water if it evaporated...seriously, I couldn't see her fish in that water.... but it lived 10 year until she decided to give it away.

[Kiara.I]

I did read online that tap water can be used if its first left to sit for 48 hours, not sure why that long as it didn't say.

Chlorine bad. ;) You can either treat the water with chemicals to neutralize the chlorine, and use the water quite quickly. Or, you can leave the water to sit out for a couple of days and the chlorine evaporates off by itself. This is the method we use for our tropical fish, as I didn't really feel like adding another step to the whole process and treating with chemicals when I didn't have to. :shrug

Sorry your fish died. That does seems sudden...

Was it maybe that your water was very different from the pet shop's? I know I've been told to open the bag (after floating for a while so the water temperature is similar) then add a bit of water from the aquarium to the bag. 20 minutes later add a bit more. And a bit more. And then tip the bag over. So basically, if the pH or the chemicals or whatever are a bit different in the tank, the fish have some chance to acclimate first in smaller steps.

[MaySunflowers]

What we did was float the bag for an hour so the temperatures would match... I was trying to do like it said online to add as little of the bag water as possible but that didn't work so we added the entire bag of pet shop water to the tank.

The thing is... the first behaved as perfectly as you could have wanted for over 4hours, not a single suspect anything and absolutely no one touched a thing... as we stayed rather glued to watching them during that time so I can be 100% sure of that.

But then while we were sitting on the sofa we noticed they seemed to be sleeping at the bottom of the tank... I remembered seeing this online but went and googled it to be sure and what they were doing fit perfectly with what I read, pictures and the you tube videos. Then within 20 minutes (might have been less as I didn't actually time it)... they died... just stopped breathing and were floating around in the current from the filter... then would swim then nothing then died.

[LovinBeingMommy]

Sounds like they might have been in shock? We've lost a few that way, no matter how careful we are.

I have seen those wire separators that splits the tank in half so you can have 2 Betta's in one tank. Not sure if it works well or not but they do sell them.

This is actually insanely stressful for the fish. They live in constant "attack mode" even though they can't reach each other. A solid divider or two tanks is better.

We have two tanks right now that my mom mostly maintains. She insists that big is easier and from what I'm seeing it's true. My beta's tank was a royal pain. The 29 galloon tanks are easy. We use tap water to fill them, but my mom puts a bit of the chemicals in. She never measures. :giggle We've had our plecostomus since 2008 when my cousin gave us all her fish. She'd had him a year or more. He's big now. :doh He and a little chinese catfish keep the tank clean, so we don't even have to clean it very often. Just partial water changes periodically. (When the filter gets noisy from lower water levels... :shifty)

I have never owned goldfish, so I can't help much with them. The pet store should replace them, though. I know the pet stores around here have like a week period that you can replace IF you have the body and receipt. If you don't have the body, it's hard to prove that the fish is dead, vs you just want another.

[MaySunflowers]

We don't have the receipt but the shop owner himself wished me off... so surely he will remember me tomorrow.

[Macky]

So sorry about the fish. :(

I would suspect it was something about the water. I would never put a fish in new water unless it had been tested first. You should be able to take a sample to the pet shop for a quick test to make sure there's nothing harmful in the water. Water isn't the same everywhere. Ours is really hard and our fish are the sort that need soft water, so we need to make adjustments and can't use all tap water. You can't really compare what you did to what someone else across the country did because your water is different.

[MaySunflowers]

I am surprisingly sad about our goldfish... or maybe more sad my daughter is sad about them.

We do have hard water (that means with minerals and all right?), but I treated it and left it all running beforehand.

Is it best to try again if we have to do an exchange or maybe try something else, like tetras? Or are those just as hard? It needs to be something cold water that we can have 2 of so both kids can have one.

[Macky]

What we did was float the bag for an hour so the temperatures would match... I was trying to do like it said online to add as little of the bag water as possible but that didn't work so we added the entire bag of pet shop water to the tank.

Wherever you read that left out the important part... you need to add the tank water gradually to the bag. Likely the reason they don't want you to add bag water to the tank is in case the water carries anything bad, but that really doesn't make any sense because you're adding the fish that was swimming in that water to your tank, so :shrug3. Adding the tank water gradually to the bag, though, is crucial to acclimate the fish to the new water. They likely either died of shock from the sudden change or there was something in your water that shouldn't have been there (like chlorine, etc.). Definitely get the tank water tested before you try again.

[MaySunflowers]

Thanks! I am hoping the petshop will test the water tomorrow as I will bring in a sample as well as the fish.... assuming they agree to it and don't just say tough! If they do... I will bring a sample with me to the other pet shop and see if they will test it before I go ahead with anything else.

I will definately introduce the next set of fish to the water as you say instead of how I did it this time.

[Macky]

Posted at the same time. :)

Yeah, it IS surprising how sad it is to lose a fish. People tend to think they don't have feelings and personalities, but they do. We've had ours for a couple of years now and the only one who died did so while we were away (he jumped :doh when the neighbour was feeding them). Very sad. :(

I'd leave the tank as it is – keep it running – and take a sample of the water back to the store with you and get them to test it. Take the results of that test and find out what sort of fish would be suitable for the kind of water you have. They'll likely match you with a fish better suited to harder water. It's easier to match the fish to the water than to fiddle with matching the water to the fish. They'll also tell you if there was anything harmful in your sample.

On the other hand, your water may be fine... you may just not have cycled it long enough. Google "fishless cycling" to see what I'm talking about. I cycled ours for a couple of weeks before adding any fish because that's how long it took for levels to come into line (I bought a home testing kit).

ETA: Posted at the same time again!

---------- Post added at 12:28 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:21 PM ----------

We make our fish water softer by mixing it half and half with distilled water. It's a tad harder than ideal for our fish, but they've done really well with the arrangement and it doesn't involve adding pH-altering chemicals which don't work very well anyway, from what I've been told. We have a distiller in the house already, though, so it's not a hardship to go out and buy it. If you don't have easy access to cheap, distilled water, it may not be an option for you.

Do you know anyone with a healthy aquarium? Getting some water from a healthy tank and adding it to your water can help it cycle faster as it adds the healthy microbes, etc. that are good for the fish (the reason you NEVER use cleaners, bleach, etc. on a fish tank).

[MaySunflowers]

I don't know anyone at all with a fish tank. I hope the pet shop can give us some answer tomorrow as I don't like mysteries!

[LovinBeingMommy]

Our water is hard. So hard that we can't grow normal algae. :doh Who would have thought that was possible? We've had success with all kinds of fish.

If you get tetras, four is a more ideal number. They're small, so you can keep more in a small tank. We have four in one of our tanks right now. Sword tails might be an option, too. I'm not sure how big a tank you have or their size off the top of my head. Tiger barbs are hardy critters. They're mean, too, but not to each other, just other kinds of fish. I wanted them to go away so my beta and angels could live in peace. Took them years to die, even with water conditions that killed other fish (two days with no power means no circulation and no heater--ouch!).

ETA: I cried when my beta died. :( He was my buddy!

[kiloyd]

Most pet shops guarantee their fish for 1 or 2 days.

[MaySunflowers]

I have found a pet shop in the next area over that specializes more in fish... so I am also going to call them after I call the pet shop I bought the fish from. Their website really encourages calling them and discussing things first before even coming in to the shop, so I will do that and see what they think my best course of action would be.

Its nearly 8 and my daughter can't sleep because she is upset about the fish... wants me to promise we won't get goldfish and will get something else.

[TenderLovingWillow]

Speaking as one who has been there and back in the world of goldfish keeping, here is what has worked, and not worked. ;)

As others have said, goldfish are dirty. I have not kept them more than a couple months without double filtration than the water usually requires. So, for a 30 gallon tank (which is min for 2 standard goldfish) you would need a 50-60 gal filter.

Cycling your tank. It took mine nearly 6 weeks starting from new, steralized rocks, tank and decorations.

Live plants can help that go a bit faster.

I would only use a syphon vacuum when cleaning the tank. The slime on the walls and covering the rocks is the bacteria that keeps the fish alive.

I have only played with fantails, pearl scales, black moores and lionhead. He standard goldfish can get to be 18-24 inches, and I couldn't commit to buying a tank big enough to house them. Most of the fancy variety won't get bigger than 5-8 inches.

IME keeping water stable in a tank smaller than 55 gallons is super hard, and requires daily monitering, and a shelf full of costly chemicals. I kept my ammonia at 0 always, and ph at 7-7.5 with mine, temp at 68 degrees F. So had better luck once I kept a heater.

I did finally keep a goldfish alive for 8 months, but this was after a YEAR of trying and over 2 grand spent, and I bought a 55 gallon tank. Once that tank cycled, it was so easy to maintain th water.

It sounds like your kids might benefit from a small schooling fish, rather than the expensive, timeconsuming potentially huge goldfish. ;) I have had great luck with a couple powder blue gouramis. Small, and easy to keep. And pretty too! Guppies are adorable as well. <3 you could get a beta and keep it with 4 neon tetras (tank raised! They die if they are wild caught) that would be fun and easy keep up. What size tank is it?

[MaySunflowers]

I don't know what my tank is actually...a small tank for sure... I don't have any idea how big galons are!

The pet store told me my tank fits 2 goldfish. I can measure my tank tomorrow (as I can't find my measuring tank at the moment) if that helps to give you an idea what size it is.

[kwisie]

Speaking as one who has been there and back in the world of goldfish keeping, here is what has worked, and not worked. ;)

As others have said, goldfish are dirty. I have not kept them more than a couple months without double filtration than the water usually requires. So, for a 30 gallon tank (which is min for 2 standard goldfish) you would need a 50-60 gal filter.

Cycling your tank. It took mine nearly 6 weeks starting from new, steralized rocks, tank and decorations.

Live plants can help that go a bit faster.

I would only use a syphon vacuum when cleaning the tank. The slime on the walls and covering the rocks is the bacteria that keeps the fish alive.

I have only played with fantails, pearl scales, black moores and lionhead. He standard goldfish can get to be 18-24 inches, and I couldn't commit to buying a tank big enough to house them. Most of the fancy variety won't get bigger than 5-8 inches.

IME keeping water stable in a tank smaller than 55 gallons is super hard, and requires daily monitering, and a shelf full of costly chemicals. I kept my ammonia at 0 always, and ph at 7-7.5 with mine, temp at 68 degrees F. So had better luck once I kept a heater.

I did finally keep a goldfish alive for 8 months, but this was after a YEAR of trying and over 2 grand spent, and I bought a 55 gallon tank. Once that tank cycled, it was so easy to maintain th water.

It sounds like your kids might benefit from a small schooling fish, rather than the expensive, timeconsuming potentially huge goldfish. ;) I have had great luck with a couple powder blue gouramis. Small, and easy to keep. And pretty too! Guppies are adorable as well. <3 you could get a beta and keep it with 4 neon tetras (tank raised! They die if they are wild caught) that would be fun and easy keep up. What size tank is it?
Huh. I'm of the ignore-them-and-let-them-fend-for-themselves school of goldfish keeping, and we have had one live three years and one two. Just an occasional vacuuming out about 1/3 of the water (and just using similar-temp tap water with a squirt of chemical balancing stuff to refill), wiping the inner walls only if absolutely necessary (and just letting the gunk float in the tank until the filter cleans it out), and feeding when the thought occurs, and even using a tank that is supposedly way too small once the first fish starting growing astronomically (the largest tank we've had is a 20-gallon tank). :giggle I do agree with having a larger filter, though. :yes

[TenderLovingWillow]

:giggle yeah, I never had luck with that. I don't vacuum the gravel super often, once the healthy bacteria is established it maintains the water. I got sick of fish dying, so I joined one of those die hard fish forums, did what they said, and my fish lived :shrug I don't think I'd keep goldfish is a small tank b/c they get to big. :think

[Earthmummy07]

The goldfish that i got when I was 6, which was kept in a square plastic tank with no filter or anything, cleaned out weekly(ish) and lived on tapwater and substandard fishfood, lived for 11years. The ones since we got a filter? Not so much :shrug

[MomtoJGJ]

I'm wondering about the "expensive goldfish" comment.... we get goldfish simply because of hte lack of expense. They are 12 cents a piece. Every other fish is at least a dollar per fish, and all other require schools of at least 3, which means you have to buy at least 7 to make sure at least 3 live :shifty

[domesticzookeeper]

No two goldfish are created equal. Some are going to fall ill no matter what you do, and some are going to survive no matter WHAT you do (or don't do). Just like some human beings can live to 112 on a steady intake of alcohol and cigarettes, it doesn't mean that's beneficial for the rest of us ;)

[TenderLovingWillow]

I made that comment b/c for *me* keeping them alive was quite expensive. I killed like nearly 20 of them trying to figure out the water, what chemicals to keep, on the test strips, ect. The tank too. This might make me :duck but from the reading I have done, keeping a fish that is potentially over a foot full size in a bowl is, uh, not ethical for me. :duck not saying anything about anyone at all. :no but it gaurentees that they won't lie as long, be as happy or be full grown. Even my 55 would be tight for a full size goldfish. It's like keeping a newfonland dog in an apartment. :duck

Anyways, I have found that spending a little extra for a fish that will live is cheaper in the log run. Guppies are cheap and super pretty. They can be kept in a smaller tank, and are more hardy than GF from just my expierance. :)

[domesticzookeeper]

I made that comment b/c for *me* keeping them alive was quite expensive. I killed like nearly 20 of them trying to figure out the water, what chemicals to keep, on the test strips, ect. The tank too. This might make me :duck but from the reading I have done, keeping a fish that is potentially over a foot full size in a bowl is, uh, not ethical for me. :duck not saying anything about anyone at all. :no but it gaurentees that they won't lie as long, be as happy or be full grown. Even my 55 would be tight for a full size goldfish. It's like keeping a newfonland dog in an apartment. :duck

:clap

Goldfish are intelligent and sociable fish. They can be trained, they recognize their caregivers, and they often form close bonds with their tankmates. There are a wide range of goldfish breeds and varieties, and around the world people put a lot of time and energy into improving breeding lines :yes

And yet despite the fact that they require even more care than many 'exotic' fish species, they have been wildly overbred (and poorly bred) and sold to the public as "cheap, easy, disposable" pets :-/ And that's just not what they are :shrug3

[MaySunflowers]

I'm off to bed in a minute... but I decided I might not bother going back to the pet shop tomorrow to get my money back... by the time I add up the bus fare I will be spending even more. I am first going to phone up the other pet shop that seems to specialize more and have a talk with them about the issue and see what they have to say and if they think I should try guppies or something or go back and try to exchange my dead fish.

This sure hasn't been the good first pet experience I had hoped for! Shame we rent where we can't have different pets... I can keep cats alive!

[MomtoJGJ]

hmmm... I always thought that goldfish grew to the size of their environment?

[Rabbit]

The local pet chains here that also sell fish really do want you to bring in a sample of your tank water. And if it's their fish that died, the test is free. Sometimes it's free anyway. They want their fish to live, for their own reputations, so a halfway decent store is invested in your success and more than willing to trouble shoot.

[Peridot]

goldfish wont grow to foot long when housed in a tiny bowl. :no put them in 30 gallon tank.... :jawdrop yeah, you'll get biguns.


I did the rescue fish, dump water, wipe walls, rinse gravel- reinsert fish with water that had sat. :shrug3 i never used a filter. :no


I think they do acclimate to their own amonia to some extent. :think

[TenderLovingWillow]

Goldfish won't grow from what I have read b/c there is no room and they are stunted, so they just die. :( it isn't healthy or in the best interest of the fish IMO. I guess I have big feeling about keeping any animal in small cramped areas just. B/c it's cheaper, easier, ect. If its not possible to give them the space they need, don't get them.. :shrug I quit keeping fish b/c I got so attached to them. It took me forever to choose them, and I researched and agonized over them, and still lost them. :( when I finally got it "right", he landlord at our new place said he didn't want my 55 gallon tank here, so I rehomed them. I miss them though. I spent hours with my fishy friends. :heart

[domesticzookeeper]

hmmm... I always thought that goldfish grew to the size of their environment?

:no

A very common myth, but no: they will continue to grow no matter what bowl or tank size they are in, but in smaller tanks the water toxicity will get to them before feeling cramped does :shrug3

Ideally, fancy goldfish need 10 gallons of water per fish and single-tails need 15-20. That's not just for room to grow, but for the amount of water they require so their own ammonia build-up doesn't overwhelm them, even at larger sizes.


I think they do acclimate to their own amonia to some extent. :think

Some do :yes Most won't :shrug3 Another common myth is that "goldfish can eat so much that they die." In reality, it's too much decaying food and excess waste that causes an ammonia spike, and that's what kills them.

[MaySunflowers]

Well.... my search for new fish is really not going well this morning. I have decided we will start off with White Cloud Mountain Minnows... and I did find somewhere that sells them... but I was asking the woman questions and she didn't even understand me and now I have no confidence in going there and buying the fish.

I have decided on a new fish strategy....

I want to start with the minnows and a plant and build a happy eco system in my tank... we may very well decide we just like that and keep it at that... but we might decide in a month or so down the line to try another goldfish.

Does that sound like a good plan?

[Earthmummy07]

We have mountain clouds :heart They are beautiful and adaptable and pretty hardy :yes

We forgot to feed them for a week or so (I though DH was doing it, he thought I was doing it :doh) and a few of them ate each other but that's neither here nor there :shifty

[TenderLovingWillow]

Sounds like a great idea. :yes

[MaySunflowers]

Alright, after the frustration of talking to the other pet store lady and her not understanding my questions...I decided to call the pet shop I bought the fish from and the fish specialish was in today so I went in and spoke with him.

I described everything completely, showed him all the equipment I bought and the whole thing.... he said that is everything completely that he does for his own fish and for the store fish and really doesn't know what went wrong.

I decided to accept the two replacement fish and also bought the plants from their tank and bought the special stresszymes/good bacteria stuff.

The new fish don't act the same as the previous 2... they are less active but very consistent in behavior. Look normal, normal fins, etc. They seem to like to stick to the bit with the filter current is and swim there and only occasionally come out and swim around.

I feed them a touch and they noticed right away and sought out the food.

Their tank became briefly hazy but has nearly cleared again and they are a bit more active now too but still seem to have favorite places to be. One is looking around more than the other now.

IS THIS BETTER? or no indication of everything?

I am soooo upset over the fish and stressed about these new ones I literally feel ill to my stomach.

My son has named his new fish Tiddles like the previous but my daughter has held back and not named hers this time so far.

---------- Post added at 01:34 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:33 PM ----------

Oh, and a question... if I have the small tank... should I avoid adding a couple of minnows later in the week or is that ok?

---------- Post added at 03:18 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:34 PM ----------

Fish are continueing to look better and better and roam around the tank more!!!! I sure hope this is all good and they won't be dead suddenly!!!!

---------- Post added at 04:33 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:18 PM ----------

Well this time yesterday our first fish suddenly turned ill and died. Today's fish are looking their most lively they have been all day!! :D Praying that means these ones will be keepers!!!

[TenderLovingWillow]

:hug I hope they do well. sounds like you are doing the best you can. I would not add the minnows right now for sure. Give your tank time to adjust. With the same reason I stated above I wouldn't add them at all, but others might have different perspectives. Good luck!

[MaySunflowers]

They are still looking awesome, I'm starting to feel happy now. Hopefully tomorrow they will be there looking just as good.

I wonder if the difference is the fish or maybe that stresszyme stuff I bought.

[TenderLovingWillow]

That stresszyme stuff is the bomb!

[Rabbit]

Wait until you're ready to upgrade tanks to add any more fish. :yes

[MaySunflowers]

Its morning and our fish are still alive and looking normal! Hoooray!!

[TenderLovingWillow]

It's possible your first fish were sick before you brought them home too. Yay for live fish!!

[MaySunflowers]

It's possible your first fish were sick before you brought them home too. Yay for live fish!!


I'm hoping that was it. Our new fish continue to look fine. I'm trying to get over my paranoia though! :lol I have one plant there that reaches the top of the tank and a bit floats at the top... I glance from the kitchen into the living room and keep having moments of "oh no one died!" then realize for the millionth time... no its just the plant.

[LovinBeingMommy]

It sounds like this pair is MUCH happier! So glad for you!