It is illegal to spank in Germany!

[rjy9343]

While I am not for the ban because I think this is a heart issue and people should be educated and shown other ways, (besides everything is only illegal if you get caught, so I don't really think it works anyway), I am still thrilled. I made it clear that I will not tolerate any sort of physical punishment and would even divorce him so that I could get an order from the judge to ensure that he could not spank Ivy. I might have gone little over the top.(Gotta love those post postpartum hormones). So he has agreed under duress that he would not even use it as a last resort. But now we are in a country that will take her away from us if we spank her!!!:rockon We do not have a choice about learning better ways anymore. The libertarian in me chaffs at this, but I am so happy that my husband and I now have an added incentive to learn and that I did not immerse myself in the punitive parenting model or I would be floundering right now. I am also thrilled, because I can now say it is against the law and I will lose her when our families pressure us to spank. And maybe just maybe, my family will see that there really are better ways. Also my husband now has a chance to see what children who are not hit are like. And that it is not chaos and that you really don't need to hit them to gain their obedience. When a punitive family informed me it is illegal to spank, this introvert could not stand it and did a happy dance for all of them to see while praising God for bringing us here.:shifty

[TenderLovingWillow]

Part of me wishes it were illegal here..

That sounds really awesome!

[Housekat]

:giggle I read the title and thought 'of course it is - what's the big deal?' and then realised you probably weren't aware of it.

I'm glad you're happy about it. And this is part of the reason why I'd love to be a libertarian but can't be because I can see the GOOD sides of an interfering government. :shifty :duck

How are you finding Germany? Settling in a bit?

[rjy9343]

:giggle I read the title and thought 'of course it is - what's the big deal?' and then realised you probably weren't aware of it.

I'm glad you're happy about it. And this is part of the reason why I'd love to be a libertarian but can't be because I can see the GOOD sides of an interfering government. :shifty :duck

How are you finding Germany? Settling in a bit?
I am from the Bible belt that is the Southern US. It never crossed my mind that you could ban spanking and have it stick. So it was a very happy discovery. :D I found out Thanksgiving. We spent the day with another American family that is very harsh. There were some rather unkind remarks about the way I parent. At first I thought they just thought since I am from the South and a Christian, they thought I was of the same mind. I was wrong, to say the least. They were directed at me and my DH. So I may have been a little to happy when they mentioned the spanking ban.:shifty But I still don't really think the government making parenting choices like that ends well. I am against spanking, but I think that a law against it only means parents will be sneaky or use other means of inflicting pain that will be unnoticed. I also think it is a very slippery slope. But hey, it's done, I am going to be thankful and praise God for his blessings and wisdom. I am liking Germany so far. Ivy does not do change at all. So the adjustments are slow. But they are coming.

[Akina]

I'm sorry for how that family treated you. Even if one disagrees, why can't some people just bite their tongue?

I had no idea it was illegal. My parents never spanked, I don't know about my friends, but it might be a newer law. I don't think spanking is as much as a debate in Germany as it is in the US. At least nobody in my family ever brought it up :)

[rjy9343]

I'm sorry for how that family treated you. Even if one disagrees, why can't some people just bite their tongue?

I had no idea it was illegal. My parents never spanked, I don't know about my friends, but it might be a newer law. I don't think spanking is as much as a debate in Germany as it is in the US. At least nobody in my family ever brought it up :)
Thank you, Anika. The thing that still has me scratching my head is that I never once mentioned where I stand on parenting issues. I figured the odds a Christian military family being like minded where pretty slim. The only thing I can think that would have provoked it is that J has told some stories about how I have handled situations or maybe told some stories that we found funny and they saw it as a discipline issue. Or that we did not tell her how it would be and just went with what she wanted.:shrug3 But we survived. And we know that they are probably not a family with whom we want a closer relationship. I have had several people assure me when I am having trouble containing Ivy that she will soon learn the danger and other helpful things. So I am confidant that I will meet people who are like minded soon.:)

[mamacat]

If only they would make homeschooling legal now

[Radosny Matka]

OT, we move mid January. We will be 4 hours away. We'll have to meet up at least once. :)

[milkmommy]

Part of me wishes it were illegal here..

That sounds really awesome!
Same here on one hand I'd LOVE the law for such blaring obvious reasons but then I cringe on how it be enforced..
A fine? :shrug3 little deterance for some more anger for others
do we say okay you got mad swatted and take the kid that seems obsessive say well you left a mark.. still ripping a kid away even for a moment excessive and more damaging..
So bad it is cronic and long term abusive well yes but we HAVE laws against that..
looping back to the first issue...
Thne do we start demanding rountinue Doctors visits ban homeschooling ect all in the name of protecting the child.
So yea the IDEA I love the an actual law not so sure of.

[Rose5000]

Wow! I am excited for you!
Um.....are their actually parents there in Germany then who DO spank even though it is illegal? ARen't they afraid to do so?

[Housekat]

IIRC leaving marks is a no no. If you are seen to smack your child in public, people can report you to social services/police.

It rarely means instant separation, but you'll be watched, parenting classes, etc. Early intervention :)

[rjy9343]

OT, we move mid January. We will be 4 hours away. We'll have to meet up at least once. :)
Absolutely. After it warms up and we both have our bearings, let's plan on it.

[Akina]

I thought it's illegal in Canada as well?

I'm not a fan of such laws either. And as for doctor visits - they are mandatory now in Germany. A couple of crazy parents starved their poor children to death, which was followed by huge public outcry, understandably so. People demanded politicians do something about this, so they decided to make all well child visits (up to 18 years) mandatory. It's a reactionary law and I doubt it will do any good. Parents who are abusers will just hold off two weeks or so prior to the doctor's visit or go under the radar completely, while normal, good parents who go like 4 days late to a visit because something came up will be punished.

[milkmommy]

I thought it's illegal in Canada as well?

I'm not a fan of such laws either. And as for doctor visits - they are mandatory now in Germany. A couple of crazy parents starved their poor children to death, which was followed by huge public outcry, understandably so. People demanded politicians do something about this, so they decided to make all well child visits (up to 18 years) mandatory. It's a reactionary law and I doubt it will do any good. Parents who are abusers will just hold off two weeks or so prior to the doctor's visit or go under the radar completely, while normal, good parents who go like 4 days late to a visit because something came up will be punished.
A this is why I dont see them allowing for homeschooling at anytime sadly.

[marigold]

I thought it's illegal in Canada as well?.

no in Canada your discipline methods are left up to your own choice. I'd love to meet some people who don't spank as I'm learning now that there are better ways but... in the circles I'm in it seems to be the norm, and until I found this site it was all I knew as well.

[dulce de leche]

Israel, Austria, Bulgaria, Costa Rica, Croatia, Cypress, Denmark, Finland, Germany, Greece, Hungary, Iceland, Italy*,Kenya, Latvia, Liechtenstein, Luxembourg, Netherlands, New Zealand, Norway, Poland, Portugal, Republic of Moldova, Romania, South Sudan, Spain, Sweden, Togo, Tunisia, Ukraine, Uruguay, Venezuela. All countries where corporal punishment of children is illegal. :) http://www.endcorporalpunishment.org/pages/frame.html

[marigold]

Wow I didn't know this at all. Thanks

[peetred]

I am probably in the minority, but I don't think stepping into the parental rights arena is a good idea.

[marigold]

A number of posters have said they don't really think that it is the government's place ...

[dulce de leche]

Honestly, I don't see it as a slippery slope. There are laws protecting adults from being hit, and although at the time people may have protested about the husband's rights being threatened, it does not weaken marriages for spousal abuse to be illegal. No one has a right to physically batter someone on the basis of relationship.

[Housekat]

Honestly, I don't see it as a slippery slope. There are laws protecting adults from being hit, and although at the time people may have protested about the husband's rights being threatened, it does not weaken marriages for spousal abuse to be illegal. No one has a right to physically batter someone on the basis of relationship.
:tu :cheer

This bears repeating

[Aerynne]

Honestly, I don't see it as a slippery slope. There are laws protecting adults from being hit, and although at the time people may have protested about the husband's rights being threatened, it does not weaken marriages for spousal abuse to be illegal. No one has a right to physically batter someone on the basis of relationship.

I totally agree. Yet I have done it. I have spanked one of my children. Several times. But not for a few months- I'm working on it, really. And while it was the wrong thing to do, I don't think he would be better off being taken away from me.

[dulce de leche]

In most of these countries, FWIU, the legislation makes it clear that children would not be taken away in most cases. Instead, the parents would be required to take classes, etc. I need to research it more, but that is what I have gathered from most of my friends living in those countries.

[NewCovenantMama]

no in Canada your discipline methods are left up to your own choice. I'd love to meet some people who don't spank as I'm learning now that there are better ways but... in the circles I'm in it seems to be the norm, and until I found this site it was all I knew as well.

I thought it was illegal to spank under age 2 or over age 12 in Canada.

[marigold]

I thought it was illegal to spank under age 2 or over age 12 in Canada.
If it is I've never heard it and I've lived here my whole life.

so I did a search online and found out you are right....:blush I guess now I know