S/O obedience and cheerfulness question

[SortaCrunchy]

In another forum, there is a new discussion on first-time obedience. Some of the conversation included how this concept requires children to stuff their emotions and doesn't equip them to handle them appropriately.

This is a spin-off question:

A few years ago, I read a blog post from a mama who described her philosophies on children obeying and she had instituted a rule called "Obey first, talk later." Basically, what she wanted her kids to do was obey her instructions first, and after they had obeyed, then they could talk to her about whatever feelings or responses they had to her request. Her kids were past the preschool years, btw.

I would love to hear thoughts on this approach.

[saturnfire16]

(please excuse typos, wacky computer)

Its still not necessarily obedience, its compliance. :shrug3

It sounds like a better alternative, but not the relationship I want with my kids.

[relizabeth]

At the children's museum where I live there's a placard on the wall stating that 4 year olds ask an average of 473 questions a day. I wonder how many of them are "why?".

We're not created to obey without understanding. :)

[allisonintx]

my dh hates explaining "why"

He is naturally compliant and obedient, though.

If I don't have a "why" I just flat out won't do something.

I operate on the philosophy that Why is important. Sometimes, I ask my children to comply without explaining, and I always promise to explain later :yes What I say is, "You need to do it (whatever IT is at the time) Discussion later." or, in a really hurried situation I say, "This is a 'yes ma'am' moment" The kids understand that. :yes

[ArmsOfLove]

true obedience has to involve understanding. I do expect this of my older children--esp the 12 and 10 year old. they've had years to question and learn and hear my explanations and answers. But the youngers are still learning AND the older children, when they encounter a new idea or instruction, are ENCOURAGED to ask questions until they understand.

[SortaCrunchy]

Thanks for the insights, ladies.

I like the "yes ma'am moment," Allison!

[WingsOfTheMorning]

Thanks for the insights, ladies.

I like the "yes ma'am moment," Allison!

I like it too. I can see how you need to be able to say that sometimes.

My thoughts on this (and I still just have one little, so...), is that I have no idea what kind of world I'm raising my kids to live in, but I have my doubts that it's a world where I want them, as teenagers and adults, to always automatically do what they're told even with the caveat of questions later.

[Love_Is_Patient]

I can see both sides. I think sometimes saying 'you need to do what i said and we'll talk about why afterwards' is appropriate. Especially if they've gotten in the habit of asking 'why' EVERY time, no matter how simple it is or how many times you've already explained' ('You need to close the refridgerator' 'why?' 'close it and then we'll talk about it'. He's not having big feelings about closing the fridge--he's just stalling :shrug We've talked a hundred times already about electricity, letting the cold air out, etc. But if I'm asking him to do something time consuming or unusual, then I'm fine with answering the why first.)

I have flat-out told my son: 'I give directions to protect and help you. You need to follow my directions and if you have questions you can ask me after you've followed them.' I think it helps to spell it out for them; especially when thinking about safety issues and having them respond quickly in danger situations.

[cornflower]

The thing is... sometimes our children know something we don't. :shrug3

A friend of mine told me (I've never googled this to see if it's true, but the concept translates, so I'm going to share it anyway) that during one of the E. Coli outbreaks that hospitalized several children due to consuming undercooked meat... that in one case a dad had *insisted* that his son eat his hamburger even though the child kept saying it tasted weird. (The dad later thought maybe his son hadn't had the words to explain that it was undercooked.)

Any way... I'm not the keeper of all knowledge, and I'm distracted often. If my child needs to make sure I have more info before they comply, I think that's healthy. Not always *convenient*, but healthy.

[relizabeth]

The thing is... sometimes our children know something we don't. :shrug3

A friend of mine told me (I've never googled this to see if it's true, but the concept translates, so I'm going to share it anyway) that during one of the E. Coli outbreaks that hospitalized several children due to consuming undercooked meat... that in one case a dad had *insisted* that his son eat his hamburger even though the child kept saying it tasted weird. (The dad later thought maybe his son hadn't had the words to explain that it was undercooked.)

Any way... I'm not the keeper of all knowledge, and I'm distracted often. If my child needs to make sure I have more info before they comply, I think that's healthy. Not always *convenient*, but healthy.

Wow. :jawdrop

[Ellen]

I can see both sides. I think sometimes saying 'you need to do what i said and we'll talk about why afterwards' is appropriate. Especially if they've gotten in the habit of asking 'why' EVERY time, no matter how simple it is or how many times you've already explained' ('You need to close the refridgerator' 'why?' 'close it and then we'll talk about it'. He's not having big feelings about closing the fridge--he's just stalling :shrug We've talked a hundred times already about electricity, letting the cold air out, etc. But if I'm asking him to do something time consuming or unusual, then I'm fine with answering the why first.)



This is where I'm at. A. will ask why every single time for every single thing. We have gone to saying, "Do it first, then ask why." I want to help her have a habit of obeying rather than stalling. However, I appreciate the reminders on this thread for why it's important to answer her questions.

[SortaCrunchy]

Definitely get what y'all are saying.

I guess I'm thinking of situations with my 5 yo where it's

Me: Please take your shoes to the shoe bin.
Dacey: But MOOOOMMMMMMM <insert her saying something that may or may not be related to the instruction but is definitely not a "big feelings" situation>

That's a weak example, but it's not unusual.

So it's not even necessarily "why" for me, but the "but MOM" stuff over ever-y-thing.

This would be where it would seem more effective to say "Obey (or "follow instructions") now, talk later."

:shrug

ETA: I realize I am going sort of OT in my own thread, because originally this was about obedience and a child's feelings about obeying. And that IS an issue, too, because DD1 is VERY prone to BIG feelings (like her mama), but sometimes it's just arguing/stalling . . .

[relizabeth]

Is it sort of more of a whining issue than a "why" issue? :think

[SortaCrunchy]

Is it sort of more of a whining issue than a "why" issue? :think

I would say OVERALL she is fairly compliant. These days, it's a lot of arguing (which can easily turn into meltdowns), but as I'm sitting here thinking about it, the big feelings episodes re: following instructions generally have a traceable root: overly tired, blood sugar, etc.

I am appreciating hearing all of the thoughts here though. Definitely perspectives I hadn't considered before.

[DolphinMemae]

I'm hearing some really good points. :yes Asking questions and listening to a child who is asking questions or objecting to compliance are sometimes important for the child's health and development. Sometimes it may not be safe to wait until later for discussion, but sometimes children will use the knowledge that Mommy or Daddy want to encourage discussion to stall or avoid doing what they already know they should do/not do. Also, there are times when prompt compliance is more important than understanding first, and it's just smart parenting to have a phrase or word or "look" that communicates to children that this is not a time when discussion first will happen.