**LYING** I need help fast, please!!

[HummusDip]

My dd almost 4, just told a big lie and I'm unsure of what to do. We made a cake yesterday to celebrate ds's nightweaning. She was given lunch and told that once she was done with it or made a good attempt at eating it, she could have a piece of cake. That's normal around here, you either finish your plate, or make a good effort. I give VERY small portions so it's not unreasonable. Anyway, she came out and said "mommy and daddy, I ate all of my lunch, see" and showed us her plate. We told her good job! And asked when her tummy was ready for a piece of cake. She said it was then so we got her a piece. Then I went to help ds out of his highchair and I notice he's eating HER sandwhich. :jawdrop

I didn't know what to do, so I just calmed told her that I found ds eating her sandwich and that she lied to me about eating it. I asked her to go to her room while I cleaned him up and calmed down.

That's where I'm at. This happened 5 minutes ago. Dh says "if she did that to me, I'd put a drop of Sharaka (hot sauce) on her tongue and tell her that every time she lies, she'll get her tongue burned". :jawdrop:mad:shiver

Obviously, I will not do that. However I do need some advise on how to deal with lying. In the past few weeks she's been telling us many lies. Links and/or article would be great so I can forward them to my dh's email as well. Thank you.:heart

[Leslie_JJKs_mom]

Jessica does that all the time. She hides her food and then tells me she ate it so she can get dessert.

[HummusDip]

On a side note, I've been thinking about doing a unit study on honesty, and referencing the Bible and reading stories about honesty and expressing how we should always tell the truth despite situations where we would disappoint our parents.

[DoulaClara]

I think you handled the first part of it well! You didn't set her up for another opportunity to tell another lie.

I think if she had already eaten the cake, the deal would be that later on that evening, she wouldn't get another piece, because she already had her dinner piece early. I would definitely do some Bible stories about honesty, and just find a way to just make sure opportunities to tell stories about what really happened are as rare as possible (and remind DH to set her up for success, too- not to ask her "Did you just do this?" but rather to say, "I know that this just happened, and while we clean it up/fix it, let's figure out what we can do now to replace it/whatever.")

[Teribear]

http://www.gentlechristianmothers.com/community/showthread.php?t=311672&highlight=words+as+magic

At this age she is firmly in the words as magic stage...she is telling the truth as she wants it to be...there are several threads on this stage, one is linked above. I think your idea of stories on honesty is a good one.

[HummusDip]

Thank you, I'll go check the link out now! I'm surprised you guys think I did ok and had a decent idea. I usually flat suck at this discipline stuff. :bag

[ArmsOfLove]

I also state truth to my children when it's a big issue. I might ask "Is that the truth? or the truth the way you wish it was?" even at 4 they usually get it. Or I say, "The truth is that you gave your sandwich to your brother. You need to always speak truth to me."

but the intent was to make everything fit with your rule while also getting cake with very little impulse control. If you look at it from a purely technical position she gave a bunch away and then ate what was left--thus meeting your requirement to eat all her lunch. Once she gave it away, it wasn't hers anymore ;)

being aware that she's in this stage now, it's helpful to keep on top of what is going on and double check things when they seem too good to be true ;)

[Raspberries]

Great responses. :heart

[HummusDip]

Exactly Crystal, she kept saying "but I did eat it! I did!" And I was like "you gave it to your brother" and she was like "I only gave him 1 and I ate 1" and I was like "but you told us you ate it ALL" and she was like "I did!!".

So it seemed like she definitely thought in her world that she did. I want to make that into a lesson, not a burning her tongue with hot sauce punishment. My dh says he wants her to do what's right because God commands it *AND* fear telling a lie. :sigh

[Raspberries]

The thing is, the punishment won't stop her from lying. It'll just make her, as she grows up, better at hiding the truth to avoid the punishment.

[HummusDip]

That's totally true, I wish he'd understand that.

[Raspberries]

Not to mention the damage it could do to her trust for him. My dad was the one that spanked me. I did not trust him as a result. I remember knowing that when he came home I was going to get spanked for something I did and it filled me with SO much anxiety and dread. That's how I started to view him. With anxiety. We're better now, but it wasn't easy and we're still not that close.

[Rose]

Not sure how well it would work in this instance, but if she is consistantly lying in the same areas (ex- eating her food) than just stay there with her. I know that for older DC, tomato staking works well... Just a thought. :)


Sorry I couldn't explain that very well. :blush

[Herbwifemama]

I also think that making the dessert the "reward" for eating all that "obligatory" food can set up unhealthy eating patterns. In this house, we get dessert and dinner at the same time, and she can eat it in whatever order she likes. Once dessert is gone, it's gone, and she can either eat until she's full, or go hungry. It works with varying success. I'm sure it would work better if I was consistent.

[WI Mama05]

I was going to chime in with the words are magic advice. Dealing with that here too. :hugheart

[TuneMyHeart]

I also think that making the dessert the "reward" for eating all that "obligatory" food can set up unhealthy eating patterns. In this house, we get dessert and dinner at the same time, and she can eat it in whatever order she likes. Once dessert is gone, it's gone, and she can either eat until she's full, or go hungry. It works with varying success. I'm sure it would work better if I was consistent.

I may need to spin this, but what if they eat the dessert and nothing else EVERY time? :shrug I tried this for a while and she ate absolutely nothing else for dinner.

[Raspberries]

Well, you could always give a tiny portion for the dessert. And dessert is relative. So it could be strawberries with a little honey, for example or whipped cream. It's a sweet treat, but still good for them.

[TuneMyHeart]

Yeah, dessert is pretty rare here. But when we do have it, good grief she absolutely won't eat anything else.

[Aisling]

4yos are notoriously dismal at fractions. :giggle If you give her a sandwich in halves, she has two sandwiches. If she gives one to brother, she still has one whole sandwich (in her thinking). She didn't have two halves, she had two pieces. Two wholes. When you insist she didn't eat her whole sandwich, she thinks *you're* a liar, because she ate a whole one, and gave a whole one to brother. :shifty Half is a really blurry concept at that age. ;) They get plural/singular. If you say: "You didn't eat your whole sandwich (singular)", she's going to think you're NUTS, because she did eat one whole piece of something.

[MtnMama]

4yos are notoriously dismal at fractions. :giggle If you give her a sandwich in halves, she has two sandwiches. If she gives one to brother, she still has one whole sandwich (in her thinking). She didn't have two halves, she had two pieces. Two wholes. When you insist she didn't eat her whole sandwich, she thinks *you're* a liar, because she ate a whole one, and gave a whole one to brother. :shifty Half is a really blurry concept at that age. ;) They get plural/singular. If you say: "You didn't eat your whole sandwich (singular)", she's going to think you're NUTS, because she did eat one whole piece of something.

I love it! So true, so true.

[HummusDip]

I also think that making the dessert the "reward" for eating all that "obligatory" food can set up unhealthy eating patterns. In this house, we get dessert and dinner at the same time, and she can eat it in whatever order she likes. Once dessert is gone, it's gone, and she can either eat until she's full, or go hungry. It works with varying success. I'm sure it would work better if I was consistent.


I know that will not work for my daughter, is the thing. She loves dessert and if she could, she would eat dessert only. As of now, for all 3 meals, I give her less than my 16 month old, by far, like 2 tablespoons of soup. 1/2 a sandwich. 1/3 of a burrito. She takes a bite and says she's full and then says "I want dessert". I sit down with her and feed her myself until it's gone or she's at least eaten a good amount. I've tried letting her eat when she's hungry instead of me initiating meal times, and she'll go from waking until about 9 am before asking for something to eat and then from then until like 4pm!!! And even then, she barely eats. She's already grossly "underweight". For instance, she wears size 12 month "pants" as capris. She's 4 next month! I feel like I need to encourage her to nourish herself... :think Maybe I'm wrong and I'm open to other things, I just don't know that they would work for our situation.

---------- Post added at 08:08 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:05 PM ----------

4yos are notoriously dismal at fractions. :giggle If you give her a sandwich in halves, she has two sandwiches. If she gives one to brother, she still has one whole sandwich (in her thinking). She didn't have two halves, she had two pieces. Two wholes. When you insist she didn't eat her whole sandwich, she thinks *you're* a liar, because she ate a whole one, and gave a whole one to brother. :shifty Half is a really blurry concept at that age. ;) They get plural/singular. If you say: "You didn't eat your whole sandwich (singular)", she's going to think you're NUTS, because she did eat one whole piece of something.


Even worse, I gave her the HALF and she thought 1 side of bread was 1 sandwich and the other side was another!!!

Another issue is suddenly she doesn't care for anything healthy...hummus, lettuce, anything green really...besides avocado. She has always loved greens! I can still get her to eat a salad if I have some schwag dressing over it, but if it's a healthy one she says "I don't like it". urrrrrg

But yes, I understand what you are saying and it makes sense in a very odd 4 year old world! :P~

[Rose]

:think Could you make healthy desserts? For example blue smoothies? Or fruit parfaits with plain yogurt & some sucanat? Making a healthy banana bread? Or cranberry orange muffins?
My dd loves blue smoothies. I make them with frozen blueberries (although any berry would work), orange juice, pomegranate juice & vanilla flavored whey.
This way, even if she's big on desserts, at least you can know she's getting good nutrients too. :heart

I have more healthy desserts if you're interested. :)

[TuneMyHeart]

HummusDip, Ellie eats EXACTLY like you just described. She'll eat one bite and say she's full, yet an hour later she's melting down and tired. She's got to be hungry!

We do lots of healthier desserts, lots of quick breads and muffins (that's usually our breakfast), but Ellie eats practically nothing else. No meat or protein, no beans, no fruits or veggies, nothing. She'll eat the ketchup on her plate and leave everything else (and I give her tiny amounts of food, like 2 beans).

[MtnMama]

:hugheart Yikes, guys! I can't imagine a child that won't eat much. It's just not something I've dealt with. That sounds hard.

[mama-hobbit]

Not about the lying... but what about having her graze instead of eat meals? I have a friend who's girls would NOT eat a serving of anything - so she started making a meal tray up and setting it on the table. They were free to eat from it at any time - but they had to sit at the table while eating. She'd keep things like grapes, nuts, ww crackers, little roles, a dish of nut butter, etc. out all morning and just add little bits as they needed refreshing. Her girls started EATING - they just didn't have tummies that wanted more then a few bites at a time. Their attitudes also improved. :)

[Herbwifemama]

Kat, your dd is JUST like my dd. She'll eat one bite, and say she's full. I've found the method I described to be helpful, but nothing here is perfect, and she eats minimally. Last night for dinner, I made shepherd's pie, and she picked all the big pieces of ground beef out of it, and said she was full. And her portions are minuscule too, just a few Tbs of food, because she doesn't EAT! She wouldn 't eat the veggies or the potatoes, even when they are vegges she's liked before. However, there was no dessert last night.

[HummusDip]

Thanks guys!

I think the grazing idea is good. We've done that before and she ate more than usual. It's just that we like to have sit down meals. But she can always sit down and eat out of her muffin tin...

Most of my desserts are healthy, but this particular one wasn't. (ice cream cake) But usually it's raw fruit crisp, "cookie" that I make with oatmeal, nut butters, dried fruit, and minimal if any sugar, or breads like pumpkin or zuc. :tu But I'm always interested in hearing other ideas! We're vegan though, so I have to be able to sub dairy alternatives. :)

[aleigh]

My DS is 4 as well & we started dealing with the lying a few months ago. He would tell me he put his dishes away while I was standing there looking at them. I would tell him again to put his dishes in the kitchen, he would stare at me for a few seconds & then say, "Okay mom. I'm done!"

To them, they aren't lying. It took me a while to realize it. So, we've talked a lot about what it means to tell the truth & what it means to lie & he really gets it now. I've learned not to ask questions I already know the answers to & to offer help when he's having trouble doing what I've told him to do. I've also told him that it's okay to tell me the truth, even when it's not what I want to hear.

With food stuff- sometimes he'll tell me that he just doesn't like dinner, but he would still really like dessert. I'm okay with that. Sometime I don't really like dinner, but I still want dessert!

[Lily2584]

I know that lying isn't right, but I admire her for sharing with her brother :tu