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mommamo
01-02-2008, 01:20 PM
I have thought and thought about posting here but I feel like I am stuck and desperately need help and I know from all my lurking that this is the place I might be able to get some. My dh and I are really trying to practice GBD. We're trying so hard to do it but both of us were raised in spanking, rather punitive households and we have gotten ourselves into a corner I guess with our 4 yo dd and I really don't know how to get out of it. I just feel like we're stuck and don't know how to find that happy middle ground between being punitive and permissive and I just really need some help. Things have gotten so bad lately and I just don't know how to help us out of this.

C (the 4 yo dd) has been diagnosed with SPD and I know that she does have sensory needs that must be met, otherwise things go downhill quickly and we are working to meet them, but I feel her behavior in the mean time has just gotten bad, for lack of any better description right now.

For one, for the past while she will get in moods where she resists using words to tell us things. She has an amazing vocabulary, better than her 9 year old cousin sometimes, but she will just refuse to say things. She will point, grunt, jump up and down, turn away if she doesn't want something, pout. Or if she wants to do something she'll smile, jump up and down, make excited noises, but won't say anything. At all. We consistently tell her that we can't help her if she won't tell us what she wants but she is so persistent in everything that she will continue this for hours. She was trying to tell me one day that the frost had melted off the car and she kept pointing and saying "look!" but would never tell me what I was supposed to be looking at, even when asked. We sat in the car for 20 minutes in the target parking lot until I finally figured it out. She refused to get out of the car during that time. If I ask if she'd like some milk instead of saying "No thank you" like she used to she'll just turn her body away and cross her arms and make an ugly face. We remind her what the polite thing is to say but she is just refusing to do it.

She has also been stubborn and tantruming about everything. This next example I really don't know if we handle right but that's why I'm asking for help! Last night we got home right at the kids bedtime (we had gone to meet my sister's fiance's parents and have dinner with them) so I know it was late. When we got home C decided she was asleep (she wasn't, but once she decides something that's the reality for her) and she wanted to be carried in. I can't carry her-she weighs 45 lbs and I'm 30 wks pg. I have a hard enough time with my 27 lb ds. DH had to go to the bathroom so I told C that I knew she was "asleep" but I was so sorry I couldn't carry her but I wanted to hold her hand and go in the house with her. I helped her out of the car where she threw herself on the ground screaming that she was cold and couldn't take another step and I had to carry her. I calmly explained that I would hold her hand but I was cold too and I needed to get all of us (brother included) in the house so we could get ready for bed. She made it into our front gate and then threw herself on the ground for the same reasons. She was screaming the entire time. I told her that I needed to get D into his pjs so he could go to bed and that she needed to come in the house. I also said that she was choosing to be cold and stay outside but D and I wanted to be warm so we were going in. She stood in our (fenced) front yard and screamed and howled. DH went outside to get some stuff we'd left in the car and he helped her up to the door but as soon as she stepped foot in the door she backed out again screaming that she needed to be carried and that she was too cold to walk. She stood on the porch howling for another minute (we were near the door). I couldn't take it anymore, and I took her hand and walked inside with her. She screamed at me and kicked me. We told her no kicking, I helped her into her bed, took her shoes off her, and told her I loved her and would see her in the morning but that her behavior was unacceptable in our family. This whole episode tore me up inside but I couldn't allow her to behave this way even if she was tired. This morning she apologized for kicking me but I would have rather not gone through this in the first place.

She is also very aggressive. When she doesn't get her way she grabs, kicks, she's stood on her 23 month old brother, she screams, etc. She does have sensory issues (she's very sensory seeking) so we've been working with her to learn to behave appropriately with other people but she is having a difficult time changing that behavior. She is refusing to help when asked (she does have chores she's expected to do but will not do them willingly). She has just had a terrible attitude in general lately. She does also have a very high energy level which just adds to this. It's frustrating though, because she is a very intelligent child and when she is not behaving this way we have the most lovely conversations and just such a pleasant time together. She really can behave nicely with her brother when she wants to and she just adores him. And I know that somewhere intellectually she knows this behavior is wrong, yet she chooses it. I am not able to get anything done because I am constantly having to make sure she doesn't hurt her little brother. My mom said that C is ruling the family right now and I don't want to allow that, but don't know what to do. She's really always been such a sweet girl, just rough and highly active, but this new personality change is making me crazy. Thanks so much for making it this far. I know this is a novel, I'm just at a loss. I really would also appreciate any prayers right now.

ProudMommaof2
01-02-2008, 02:00 PM
I will gladly pray for you and your DD if you wouldn't mind praying for my DS and me. :hug2 We are soo in the same boat, so I don't have any good advice, unfortunately, but maybe we can assume this is a four-year-old phase that will pass... :pray4.
My DS is so into doing the not-speaking thing in spite of his amazing vocabulary, just as you describe with your DD, and he has been acting very disrespectful and angry off and on lately as well. He can be the absolute sweetest, most pleasant little guy, and then turn around and be very sassy and nasty tempered. He isn't physically aggressive, but he will hit out at me without making contact when he is angry. I know how frustrating this is momma, and I hope some other mommas here will have some good advice for us.

Oh, one thing I have tried when my DS won't use his words is to baby him excessively. I had wondered if he was doing it out of being jealous of his 18 month old sister, and tried everything I knew to do, but everything either didn't work or would escalate the situation. Finally I tried what one mom suggested, and for instance, when he would grunt and point instead of asking me to help him with the zipper on his coat I cuddled him and said, "Come here my baby and let momma help you with that." in a really crooney baby-talk voice. He promptly piped up and said, "I'm not a baby!" I call him "baby" alot as a lovey name and he doesn't mind, but for some reason when I did it in that voice and was coddling him he decided to change his tune and talk with his words. :giggle It hasn't worked every time, but I have had more success with this tactic than anything else I've tried. :shrug

Rose5000
01-02-2008, 05:14 PM
I'm wondering if the real help of these forums is not necesarily in answers and advice as in comraderie. AGain, I came on here and opened up this thread because I am looking for some salve to soothe my poor mother-soul over the mis-behaviors of my almost 4 yo boy. Please forgive me if what you are really looking for is advice....I'm sorry I cannot give it right now. But I do do hope that somehow just knowing that other mothers of 4 yo's are going thru so much of the same trials will comfort you......It reminds me of 1 Peter 5:9---"knowing that the same sufferings are being accomplished in your brethren who are in the world"....and verse 10: "but the God of all grace, who has called you to his eternal glory in Christ Jesus, will, after you have suffered a little while, make you perfect, establish, settle, strengthen you."

I'm going to say a prayer for all of us.

Dear Heavenly Father,
Please help your mothers of 4 year old, to know how to parent them. Help us all to understand grace based parenting. Guide us in our tone of voice with our youngsters. Calm us when our children rile up our emotions, and grant that we may not respond to them in kind....with anger, even though they are frustrating us so much.
In Christ' s name, Amen

(sorry, I have to go or I would have written more; ds4 is calling me). Love to all of you,
Rose

Praise
01-02-2008, 06:47 PM
Couldn't read this without sending hugs and prayers. :hugheart :pray4

MarynMunchkins
01-02-2008, 07:13 PM
:hug2 My Banana was a lot like that at 4.

What sensory activities are you doing with her during the day?

asher
01-02-2008, 07:19 PM
:hugheart :pray4 for you.

ProudMommaof2
01-02-2008, 09:44 PM
I'm wondering if the real help of these forums is not necesarily in answers and advice as in comraderie. AGain, I came on here and opened up this thread because I am looking for some salve to soothe my poor mother-soul over the mis-behaviors of my almost 4 yo boy. Please forgive me if what you are really looking for is advice....I'm sorry I cannot give it right now. But I do do hope that somehow just knowing that other mothers of 4 yo's are going thru so much of the same trials will comfort you......It reminds me of 1 Peter 5:9---"knowing that the same sufferings are being accomplished in your brethren who are in the world"....and verse 10: "but the God of all grace, who has called you to his eternal glory in Christ Jesus, will, after you have suffered a little while, make you perfect, establish, settle, strengthen you."

I'm going to say a prayer for all of us.

Dear Heavenly Father,
Please help your mothers of 4 year old, to know how to parent them. Help us all to understand grace based parenting. Guide us in our tone of voice with our youngsters. Calm us when our children rile up our emotions, and grant that we may not respond to them in kind....with anger, even though they are frustrating us so much.
In Christ' s name, Amen

(sorry, I have to go or I would have written more; ds4 is calling me). Love to all of you,
Rose

:heart

mommamo
01-03-2008, 08:12 AM
Thanks for all the support. This may just be a tough stage we're going through but I'm just wanting to get some this under control before our new baby is born. I worry about D's safety often and he's almost 2. I can't be out of the room to put laundrey in the dryer or mop the kitchen or anything because C will very often get too physical. She does it when I'm around but i can usually catch it pretty quickly and help her find appropriate ways to play but I worry how I will handle everything with the new baby here too. I'm just worried. Plus, I want my sweet girl back, not this mouthy little thing who is currently residing in our house, you know? I guess I'm just looking for a magic answer (aren't we all though) and I know it will just take more time and patience than I currently have. Any insight into this problem will be definitely welcomed. Also any books I could read that might help will be appreciated too. I've read Raising Your Spirited Child and the accompanying handbook, and I've read about every book out there on SPD. I'm currently reading the only one I haven't read (Raising A Sensory Smart Child, I think) and I'm about to read Raising Your Child's Social IQ. So I'm very open to reading anything, as long as I can get it via ILL from our library.

As far as sensory activities throughout the day, we were in OT and have recently been released (although I don't feel we were ready yet). We're still doing the brushing/joint compressions that the OT had us doing every 2 hours and that helps a lot with the activity level and impulsiveness. My goal is to get us outside for at least an hour every day but I have been so cold this pregnancy that even with warm clothes on I can't stand it if the temp is under about 50 if it's windy, and it's almost always windy here. But luckily today or tomorrow it's supposed to be in the mid 60s so we'll try and get outside some. But if we stay inside we try to do relays up and down the hall, bounce on her big ball with the handle (if you know what I mean-we had those as kids.) I try to give her appropriate outlets for her energy.

Anyway, thanks for the support and prayers. It's nice to know there are others praying for you. Also, it's nice to know I'm not alone with these behaviors. I'm just ready to be past all of this and have an easy going cooperative child again. At least for a couple weeks before the baby is born. C doesn't handle any change well at all, so I know that for a month or two after the baby is born it's going to get rough again. With D too because he's used to being the baby. I'm just wanting some peace before then.