cultural choice not parenting choice...

[Living My Dream]

... is basically what came out of a conversation someone was having with me about BW. They said that given the chance, mothers in the bible would now choose a super pram or something as apposed to carrying their children - this is something that they had to do. The same was said about co sleeping, that it was the times not a choice. so again, the thought was that given todays options of nice houses and beds etc, co sleeping would not happen. The idea behind this was from a very popular verse this time of year, "Mary wrapped Him in swaddling cloths and laid him in a manger." So the idea was, from said person, that swaddling was used as a choice, but she chose to let Jesus sleep in a manger seperate to mum and dad not babyworn or cosleeping. ("the stable will have had something for mary and joseph to lay on so if it was a parenting choice baby Jesus couldve laid with them")

Not wanting to cause an argument, just wondered what others would've said and your views. They are not mean people and were not having a go at me for my parenting choices - i think they we generally interested.

[WanderingJuniper]

But Mary and Joseph were in the manger because there was no room in the inn where it seems unlikely they had a port-a-crib stashed in the housekeeping closet just in case a baby needed to stay. And, seeing how much work was actually involved in being a woman in such cultures the probability of using a stroller over babywearing seems slim. You can accomplish so much more babywearing than when babe is in a stroller. :shrug

[joy]

I would say to your friend that I think the point of the manger is more to emphasize the humble beginning God took when he entered the world. I wouldn't take it as inadvertent instruction and I don't think it was intended that way. Given that the scripture doesn't say anything about how/where Mary and Joseph slept, could we assume they didn't sleep at all? So folks who are sleepless with a newborn are following a biblical mandate? :)

[Marzipan]

Here is an article that I find kind of related. It's about strollers in Kenya. http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A34654-2004May17?language=printer

[ShiriChayim]

:scratch I would say that I don't babywear or co-sleep because it's Biblical, I do it because it's what's best for the baby, what's best for the family, and I just love to have my little one snuggled up to me at every moment possible. :shrug Babywearing is also easier than strollers IMO, and there's often that I can't use my stroller, but I can use a sling.

[TestifyToLove]

Obviously, this person has never seen a real manger. My honest guess is that Mary AND Jesus were in that manger to avoid getting trampled on by animals in that overcrowded stable. Now, don't know what she was planning on doing when the animals got impatient and wanted to EAT. But, most mangers will hold a full size grown adult man. They are a partitioned off area where the feed and hay is thrown to feed the animals. There's often a small tray at feeding level for things like corn and minerals. But, the bulk of the manger is a box which holds...BALES OF HAY.

Pretty sure Mary still co-slept. She just did it where both she and her baby were safe.

[domesticzookeeper]

Obviously, this person has never seen a real manger. My honest guess is that Mary AND Jesus were in that manger to avoid getting trampled on by animals in that overcrowded stable. Now, don't know what she was planning on doing when the animals got impatient and wanted to EAT. But, most mangers will hold a full size grown adult man. They are a partitioned off area where the feed and hay is thrown to feed the animals. There's often a small tray at feeding level for things like corn and minerals. But, the bulk of the manger is a box which holds...BALES OF HAY.

Pretty sure Mary still co-slept. She just did it where both she and her baby were safe.


:yes :yes

It's a popular misconception is that mangers are like little cribs :rolleyes2

[BHope]

Here is an article that I find kind of related. It's about strollers in Kenya. http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A34654-2004May17?language=printer


I'll have to go re-read the article to make sure, but if it's similar to the one I read a couple years back, the whole thing had me rolling my eyes.

Okay, I'm back. And I'll admit that I'd advocate BWing anyday over strollers, I will say that the whole article is fairly annoying. The assumption is that S. African mothers don't use strollers because they're concerned about attatchment and child-freedom. When really the genuine crux of the issue is boiled down into these two statements from the article:

"Besides our roads aren't even good enough for these devices. If everyone had a pram it would cause jam-ups in traffic. Then we would be bad to our children and bad to our roads."

But because the pram is not only socially unacceptable but expensive, merchants are finding they aren't selling. The average pram, though far cheaper than some car-like U.S. models, still hovers around $60, at least half a month's wages even in Africa's most successful urban economies.

If you told me I could use a cloth to carry my child or spend HALF a months wages to buy a stroller for an economy that wouldn't even support the usage of said stroller. I would think you'd lost your rocker!

[Marsha]

I don't try to justify my choices based on third world countries, or 2000 years ago. I bet a lot of it is cultural. People walked more in Bible times, or rode donkeys, too, and I still drive my car. LOL

So I wouldn't think those arguments held water either unless you were Amish and truly lived simply in all areas of life.

They are choices I make because they fit who I am and who I want to be more than the alternatives.

[HomeWithMyBabies]

I don't try to justify my choices based on third world countries, or 2000 years ago. I bet a lot of it is cultural. People walked more in Bible times, or rode donkeys, too, and I still drive my car. LOL


That's how I feel too. I do what works. It's actually a pet peeve of mine when we take a practice, like babywearing, and say that because Jesus was probably worn that's why (that it's a reason) I'm going to babywear. Likewise just because he may have been put down for a second in a feeding trough I'm not going to rush out to buy a crib. ;)

[mommylove]

Obviously, this person has never seen a real manger. My honest guess is that Mary AND Jesus were in that manger to avoid getting trampled on by animals in that overcrowded stable. Now, don't know what she was planning on doing when the animals got impatient and wanted to EAT. But, most mangers will hold a full size grown adult man. They are a partitioned off area where the feed and hay is thrown to feed the animals. There's often a small tray at feeding level for things like corn and minerals. But, the bulk of the manger is a box which holds...BALES OF HAY.

Pretty sure Mary still co-slept. She just did it where both she and her baby were safe.


Ditto. Plus, I'd definitely be sleeping in the poop-free zone! :giggle