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Hopeful
05-19-2007, 12:05 PM
OK, I'm really wondering whether or not to continue APing.

I always thought I'd be a strict mother with a well organized household and obedient children who had been taught to go to sleep (ie CIO, and sleep in their own beds.
I'm not that for various reasons and I just feel that I haven't accomplished my aim and am therefore not a good mother.

Also, breastfeeding. It's supposed to minimise eczema, be better for brain development, etc, etc...
Yet Nathan at 21mo is still nursing 6x per 24hrs, has terrible eczema, isn't talking much...

I just feel like, "Why did I bother??"

Sure, it's great but he has never slept thru the night and no matter what people say bottlefed kids do sleep better.

I'm really debating about forcing Nathan to go to bed at 7pm in his bed on his own and I debating about whether or not to nurse the new baby.

(Nathan demanding nummies so I have to stop here)

Mamatoto
05-19-2007, 12:19 PM
Deep breaths, mama....it's hard to know what sort of mother you are going to be until you have children and actually experience the love, intimacy, and incredible intuition of a mother. :heart It's okay for your goals to change, but I encourage you to not worry about age, hours, or times and focus on where you are in your connection and relationship...those things can never be measured but they really are the most important. :hugs As far as eczema goes, have you tried an elimination diet? My horrible eczema that I battled my whole life is gone when I stay away from the trigger foods for it. My ds starting sleeping through the night just after age two...you are at the stage where many many children (it's documented in college textbooks!) have a needy nursing/up at night stage. It will get better. :yes

MarynMunchkins
05-19-2007, 12:23 PM
:hug2

My first child I nursed on a schedule, let CIO, and was sleeping 12 hours through the night at 12 weeks. He talked at 8 months, and could say simple sentences by 21 months. He was spanked from the time he was 15 months old.

My second child I nursed on demand, let CIO, and didn't sleep through the night until she was 4 years old. She talked at 6 months and by 21 months knew her alphabet, could count to 15, and spoke in compound sentences. She had exzema and huge sensory issues. She was spanked as well.

My third child I nursed on demand, co-slept, and didn't sleep through the night until 27 months. He talked at 8 months, and at 21 months used simple sentences only I could understand. ;) He was sensitive to dairy and soy, and broke out whenever he was exposed to them. He's never been spanked.

My 4th child I nurse on demand and co-sleep. At nearly 8 months, she only wakes once or twice in the middle of the night. She can say 3-4 words, and has never had a rash in her life.

The reason my parenting has changed is because my children have changed. It's okay to modify what you're doing because you're miserable. But don't abandon everything you've believed in because it doesn't have the immediate results you hoped for. AP and GBD is a long-haul process. There aren't quick results because we're working to make obedient, loving adults, not obedient children.

Katigre
05-19-2007, 12:41 PM
((((((hugs)))))))) Remember that AP doesn't have to be all or nothing. If something is not working in your family dynamic - then work towards changing it and don't feel guilty like you've failed some sort of list of ideals! At the same time, I would encourage you to re-examine your underlying assumptions and goals about mothering and what your child should be doing at his age - b/c that can help with things too.

It sounds like there are two issues here:
1. Sleep Issues
2. Feeling like the promises of Bf'ing have not come true for your family and that formula would have been just as good if not better b/c it would have taken care of issue #1

So let's tackle #1 first. At 21 months you can definitely work to get him sleeping in his own bed, at a certain time, and not be considered 'un-AP' unless by doing that you mean plopping him in a crib and shutting the door without opening it until morning regardless of whether he is upset. There are a lot of AP moms I know who transitioned their kids from cosleeping to being in their own beds/cribs sometime between 12-24 months. If you want to do that and feel it is what you all need - then we can provide lots of links, resources, and suggestions for how to accomplish this. It will also require your DH's help in the process. If you want to cut out nursing before going to sleep you can do that, but you could also move it earlier in the process so he doesn't fall asleep nursing. Now - the first week or so of doing this will probably be stressful b/c you'll all have to adjust to a new way of doing bedtime. But if you are consistent then it will help things. He might not necessarily go to sleep at 7pm, but you can set a regular bedtime and routine according to his sleepy cues.

Also - I have friends who are mainstream. They do CIO. And they still have issues with sleep and bedtime with their kids. CIO does not solve all problems - if all you had to do was CIO for an hour or two one or two nights, more people would follow that method. But it doesn't work that way. For the *vast majority* of kids you have to CIO more than once - after each time you travel, after each time they get sick and get off-schedule, after teething, etc... CIO is their regular 'tool' just like nursing to sleep is our regular 'tool'. It is a regular part of their nighttime life as a family. And it is hard on the parents! I see them write about how hard it is for them. So I don't want you to idealize CIO as something that would be a quick fix - b/c it likely wouldn't. AND - if he is old enough that just one or two nights of CIO would be a true quick fix, then there are other more gentle sleep solutions that would work equally well - and we will be happy to help you brainstorm them!

2. Breastfeeding Issues. It sounds like there are a few issues here.

A. Extended Nursing: It sounds like you are feeling frustrated with nursing 6x/day. Can you pinpoint why that is exactly? Do you feel that your DS is very demanding to nurse and you are finding it hard to set limits? (I'm guessing in that direction by your comment at the end of your post). If you felt that you weren't at the mercy of his nursing requests but that instead you had more of a say in how nursing went, would you feel more comfortable with it, or are you wanting to wean altogether? There is no AP law that says you must nurse your toddler/child whenever and wherever they want. You can set limits. You can restrict nursing to only certain times of day or certain locations in the house.

My DS is 14 months and nurses a few times during the night as well as during the day. He doesn't eat many solids, so i'd estimate he nurses 7-10 times total. I am ok with that. I went into cosleeping expecting that he would nurse at night and not STTN for a long time - probably until he nightweaned. If I felt I had to, I would nightwean him. And your DS is at the age that you could gently nightwean him too. I have a good link from Dr. Jay Gordon for how to do that. Anyway, i'm just saying that 6x/day at 21 months sounds really great to me! But I know others have different expectations for different ages, and it also depends on how well he is eating solids.

B. Promises of Bf'ing didn't come true issue: I was breastfed as a baby. I have allergies, asthma, and eczema. I know without a shadow of a doubt that if i had been formula-fed my allergies/asthma/eczema would be FAR worse b/c I am sensitive to dairy and soy and those are the formulas available at the time. Breastfeeding makes those issues less severe and less likely to happen - it doesn't prevent them 100% in each child. And remember that the benefits of bf'ing are far more than making a child smarter (and later language development is not nec. indicative of intelligence, just like talking early doesn't necessarily indicate a child is smarter. And plus he's a boy - they develop language later than girls do on average). It provides perfect nutrition, you never have to worry if they are getting the nutrients they need b/c it is formulated just for them. And the long-term health protection from obesity, heart disease, diabetes, etc... is also great. Plus the immune system protection. And for you too! Bf'ing helps reduce the risk of a number of cancers for you. Just b/c you can't see all the healthful effects of bf'ing doesn't mean they're not there :).

All that to say - we are here for you to support you. And remember that you are entering into the transition between babyhood and toddlerhood where you'll be moving more and more into GBD and setting appropriate boundaries and such. And you can do that with nursing and sleeping too in a way that is respectful of both you and your child.

Beauty4Ashes
05-19-2007, 02:21 PM
My younger son is a little older than yours (almost 23 months old) and he is nursing at night still and nurses about 6-8x a day. I understand the feeling that you just want your body to be left alone now and then. My dc were sick a lot this past winter, it felt like it was almost non stop sickness for months. Both were nursed, and I wondered what I was doing wrong, why weren't they healthier. Like a PP mentioned, it could have been much worse had they not been nursed. :hug2

illinoismommy
05-20-2007, 06:22 PM
((((((hugs)))))))) Remember that AP doesn't have to be all or nothing. If something is not working in your family dynamic - then work towards changing it and don't feel guilty like you've failed some sort of list of ideals!


:yes You have to find what's right for your family

This is my opinion. I honestly don't think "the bottle" is the answer... there are other factors at work. If you are not comfortable with still nursing 6 times a day, you can encourage it to drop to 4 times or what you are comfortable with, its important that you feel good about what you are doing with your son and if that means you can't do perfect child-led weaning that's okay. One thing our family does different is that we do not cosleep (which even mainstream people are doing these days). She sleeps in a crib next to our bed where we disturb each other little and I can peek at her at will. This is what works for us, and I still love her just as much as anyone.

I think what is important about attachment parenting is that you are nurturing the connection between you and your child, and its hard not to be connected to your child when you cosleep, breastfeed, babywear, etc. Those are just tools to help the connection grow strong, but if you can do it without meeting the entire "checklist" while still meeting the needs of your child and yourself, then by all means find what works for your family

Hopeful
05-21-2007, 05:21 AM
Thank you SO much for all your replies. :heart

I have never set nursing boundaries for Nathan. I guess my frustration with nursing is that i'm tempted to see it as the cause of his sleep habits.

I have conflicting feelings regarding nursing and co-sleeping...on the one hand I love the snuggles of nursing and those big blue eyes looking up at me adoringly but sometimes I wish he would nurse less frequently. He depends on it so much that I am not comfortable with saying no. :doh And co-sleeping...I do wish sometimes (ie tonight) he'd sleep in his own bed but the rare times I have put him in his own bed I've almost had a panic attack bc he wasn't with me and each time I barely slept waiting for him to wake up so I could bring him in our bed where I guess I feel he belongs. :doh In my mind I always thought a child would want bedtime stories and teddies but Nathan isn't interested in either.

To be honest, I think a lot of my anxieties are coming from this pgy and me really not feeling ready at all to have a 2nd child. I had a nervous breakdown when Nathan was 10mo old for which I am still on meds and I am worried that motherhood and I are just incompatible and that I will completely lose my mind when the new baby comes :nails. My 12wk scan is on Monday and I'm petrified there might be something wrong with the baby.

Mamatoto
05-21-2007, 07:07 AM
Have you spoken to your doctor who prescribed your meds? You may need a dose change...my PPD always started when I was pregnant and the anxiety is really hard to live with. :hugheart

klpmommy
05-21-2007, 12:09 PM
I just want to give you a :hug .

Every kid is going to be different. And you can set boundaries & still be AP. I fully weaned my dd at 22 m/o. But I did it gently, without cio & over the course of 6 months & I replaced her need for nursies with snuggles b/c that met her needs better. I still consider myself AP. I sleep in my own bed most of the night now & the kids sleep in theirs. They would still love to sleep with us, but we gently moved them over (or more accurately, moved me out). I still consider myself to be AP. B/c AP has to work for the *whole* family, it isn't a "walk all over mom" scenario. So if something isn't working for you, you can figure out a way to change it so that it does, change it gently & still be AP. :hug

As for my two kids- P was BWed for 10 m, which meant he was schedule fed (so nursing didn't last long at all), made to cio during the day & at night at 12 weeks, was not worn, etc. He crawled at 9m 9d, walked at 16 m, said his first word at 18 m. He quit sleeping through the night around the time his little sister joined us (13 m) b/c he started to have night terrors. Going on vacation with him was no fun b/c of sleep so we taught him to cosleep right before his second birthday. He never took a paci, still sucks his thumb when tired or watching tv, & has a special puppy & blanket that he has to have to sleep with.

E was more AP'd from day 1, although we didn't completely "buy into" it for a while. I introduced her to a paci at 6 m in desperation & it helped me a lot. She only nursed to sleep & nursed a lot through the night- but that is what made going on vacation with her a breeze, she didn't care where we were, she just needed to nurse & she was out. She was baby-worn (until she didn't want to be anymore b/c she was a good walker & had to keep up with big brother). She crawled at 9m 10d, walked at 13 m, said her first word (very understandable!!!!) at 8.5 m, was saying 2 word sentences by a year, four word sentences at 16 m, etc. I nightweaned her at 18 m but she didn't really sttn until recently & I still often have to get up with her once to help her find her paci or something else. But she falls right back asleep most of the time.

Every kid is different. Just b/c your first is high needs does not mean that your second one necessarily will be.

momaich
06-04-2007, 07:22 AM
I read your post and thought {{{{{Big Hugs to you}}}}}}} I feel frustrated at times too. My kids have asthma and allergies and food issues and anger control issues and I've done everything right!!!!!! ;) I read a few of the others posts and they sounded more helpful than anything I could write, but I did want to empathize with you.