Ted Tripp is coming to my church for a Parenting seminar

[Learninggentleness]

I love my church, except for their stance on spanking. There is going to be a parenting seminar next month called "Raising the Bar on Raising Your Kids". Ted Tripp (author of Shepherding a Child's Heart) is the speaker.

Session 4 is going to be on "Corrective Discipline - Spanking; Sowing and Reaping." Here is a quote from the brochure about that session: "The Proverbs make a clear case for spanking, especially in dealing with small children. This teaching will provide clear guidelines for physical discipline that is gracious and kind. The second part of this session will explore the sowing and reaping principle."

My church has such wonderful, rich biblical teaching, which is why it's so hard for me to see things like this going on. I do have to say, it's hard for me not to second guess myself re: my newfound beliefs about not spanking and implementing principles of GBD, when my pastor, who I adore and look up to immensely, says that Ted Tripp's book is a classic book on raising children. I get frustrated because I disagree so strongly, but then wonder in the back on my mind if he might be right ("am I missing something" kind of thoughts float through my brain). I think I need to develop a better, clearer understanding of why exactly I believe what I do about GBD. I need to be even firmer in my beliefs.

[Mamaka]

ITU how you are feeling. It can be hard to be the voice of dissent, especially when people we love and respect feel strongly about things which with we disagree. It saddens me to see how much of Christianity has bought into the "Biblical-ness" of spanking.

I'm sorry this seminar :rolleyes is happening at your church. :hug

[Hermana Linda]

I get frustrated because I disagree so strongly, but then wonder in the back on my mind if he might be right ("am I missing something" kind of thoughts float through my brain). I think I need to develop a better, clearer understanding of why exactly I believe what I do about GBD. I need to be even firmer in my beliefs.

I have a lot of links to anti-spanking essays on my website (in my sig), if that would help. You might find the Rod Study helpful. I know it helps me, when I have doubts.

[Learninggentleness]

Thank you :tu That's a big help. I'll be reading everything over from that site over the next coming days and weeks as time allows.

[Knitted_in_the_wom]

Probably not what you want to hear...but my husband and I recently left our church because they were sponsoring a Tedd Tripp seminar. It was last weekend. We tried for 6 months to raise concerns, and kept getting blown off. Finally things started rolling with responding to us, but we kept being told that we were "taking things out of context" (no specific examples given though of what we were taking out of context), that we should just submit to the authority of our church, and finally our pastor told my husband that he DID believe than an 8 month old could be rebellious and should be spanked. That was pretty much the end of discussion--we left.

Jenn

[erinee]

Definitely stay far away from the seminar, and in the meantime (since you will probably have people trying to prod you into going) spend extra time here and at some of the GCM mamas websites (Crystal's, Joanne's, Linda's -- a lot of people have good info).

I'll be praying for you! I know how hard it is when your church is a spanking environment.

[Katherine]

I had one pretty serious "doubting" episode, too, after I had stopped spanking. It mainly sprung from the "If I'm right, then everyone else is wrong.. how can that be?" mindset, and also from the fact that I had looked up "shebet" in Strong's and there was, in fact, a literal meaning that referred to punishing. :think

I sat up one night looking at the rod verses... going through them one by one and looking over Joan's rod study. As I dug deeper I became more and more at peace with my initial decision to change. :hug Sorry this is happening.. :( It grieves me that so many Mommas here have had or are currnetly experiencing similar struggles with their church families.

[grandmama]

<<<<that we should just submit to the authority of our church>>>>

That phrase right there sends up incredible warning signs. Does submitting to church authorities mean that you put your brain and convictions on hold?

Been there.....done that.....never again.

[chelsea]

"Raising the Bar on Raising Your Kids"
The very name sounds violent! Like "Raising the Rod and Bringing It Down on Your Kids" or something! Ouch! :td

[ArmsOfLove]

Think how I felt when I wrote the book and it goes against what everyone appeared to be teaching at the time :wow But since then there have been many books I've found and many more written from Christians who have actually done the exegesis that I did and come to similar conclusions. Clay Clarkson is a great one because he previously taught spanking and has recanted his previous position!

[Sara]

I would agree that you should stay far away from the seminar. Immerse yourself in reading positive discipline books, articles, websites, etc. We are currently (I saw currently because it is a process and we have found it difficult to just make a clean break) leaving our church because of some similar things (but more related to Ezzo). Being around those kinds of people and teachings was absolutely detrimental to my relationship with my children and I have felt so much more healthy and clear-headed since getting away from that. Unfortunately, I'm stuck feeling as though I will never find a church that will meet our needs and I'm missing Christian fellowship, but I know that God will show us the way.

Anyway, I'm not suggesting that you have to leave your church! I reread my post and realized it may sound that way. I'm just sharing my experience with you. :hug

[Learninggentleness]

We actually have gone through A LOT within the last three years re: our church situation. We were going to one church a couple of years ago, left for several important reasons, went to another church for a year...and left because of a huge transformation in what we learned about biblical interpretation and a big growth spurt in understanding doctrine (the previous two churches were wrong in many of their teachings). Then, we found this church a year ago and have been going to it ever since and we LOVE IT. The people are amazingly loving and welcoming to us, the teaching is so grounded in scriptural truth, and much more. :tu BUT, this spanking thing is a thorn in my side. :sick It hasn't been an issue too much with me and other mothers yet...well maybe because I am relitively new to GBD...we'll see. My husband and I still feel extremely blessed to be at this church though.

I will continue to get grounded on why I do not believe in spanking and other punitive behaviors. I want to know all the reasons why inside and out, AND I want to grow in my skills as a GBD parent. It's going to be a long process though :shifty

[Micah]

I am going to try to keep this short. :shifty:

Last year we went through a 'phase' of not being able to find the *right* church and after visiting church after church after church...we've come to the conclusion that there is NO perfect church. :)

If it's not this thing it would most likely be another...

So that said, if I were you (which I'm not so take THAT with a grain of salt :lol:)
I would not attend any of the parenting seminars now or in the future at this church unless it was a seminar on GBD parenting.

You seem to really love your church besides this 1 thing...that's not too bad ya know?
I am sure that within that same church there is 1 family who abhors the way some dress (and it's just as important to them as GBD is to you), that there is 1 family who thinks anyone for putting their kids in PS is nuts, that there is 1 family who believes that kids should not be allowed to date until 18 and graduated, that kids should not have a drivers liscense at age 16 and the list really could go on....

So again you say you love this church, does the church constitution, doctorine, or covenant say anything at all re: we must spank blah blah..if not then personally I'd not leave a church that I otherwise loved as much as you appear to love yours...I would just skip the seminars. And the next time you hear hard core preaching from the pulpit on spanking, well it's quite easy to excuse yourself right? :)

Just a different view.

[Hermana Linda]

Last year we went through a 'phase' of not being able to find the *right* church and after visiting church after church after church...we've come to the conclusion that there is NO perfect church. :)

If it's not this thing it would most likely be another...

So did we. And I totally agree. :tu

[grandmama]

I am going to try to keep this short. :shifty:

Last year we went through a 'phase' of not being able to find the *right* church and after visiting church after church after church...we've come to the conclusion that there is NO perfect church. :)

If it's not this thing it would most likely be another...

So that said, if I were you (which I'm not so take THAT with a grain of salt :lol:)
I would not attend any of the parenting seminars now or in the future at this church unless it was a seminar on GBD parenting.

You seem to really love your church besides this 1 thing...that's not too bad ya know?
I am sure that within that same church there is 1 family who abhors the way some dress (and it's just as important to them as GBD is to you), that there is 1 family who thinks anyone for putting their kids in PS is nuts, that there is 1 family who believes that kids should not be allowed to date until 18 and graduated, that kids should not have a drivers liscense at age 16 and the list really could go on....

So again you say you love this church, does the church constitution, doctorine, or covenant say anything at all re: we must spank blah blah..if not then personally I'd not leave a church that I otherwise loved as much as you appear to love yours...I would just skip the seminars. And the next time you hear hard core preaching from the pulpit on spanking, well it's quite easy to excuse yourself right? :)

Just a different view.


The problem is that the church, by hosting the seminar, is endorsing the contents of the seminar. It is completely different than one person or family having preferences in areas like dress, driving age, etc. The ramifications of this seminar are really pretty staggering when you think that a church is endorsing this man and his teachings.

[Micah]

The problem is that the church, by hosting the seminar, is endorsing the contents of the seminar. It is completely different than one person or family having preferences in areas like dress, driving age, etc. The ramifications of this seminar are really pretty staggering when you think that a church is endorsing this man and his teachings.


I totally understand what you are saying and I agree with the point your trying to make, really I do.

However, I do think that if someone chose to stay at a church that endorses spanking it is possible to co-exist, pray, set a good example, and be 'salt' to those who are open to gentler ways, and there very well may be!

I had not even heard of (which many have not!) gentle discipline until about 4 months ago.

As such is the case with where we attend now, they believe in the rod...if a seminar came we would not be there, that simple. Of couse with this comes the realization that within our specific denomination it is very hard to find a church that does not endorse spanking.

I just don't want the OP to feel guilty if she does stay because of what may be said here...so I wanted to offer a different side of the coin (re: staying/leaving) that's all. :) And I DO agree that the ramifications can and probably will be staggering...sad. :cry

However rather then this thread turning into a debate about churches and endorsement (which we already know it does!) we need to offer guidance, support and prayers to the OP as it's her thread. ;)

ETA: I just re-read the OP and she didn't ask in the first place if we think she should stay or leave, so I apologize for giving an unsolicited answer! :doh Basically she was simply stating that she 2nd guesses herself after being influenced with this type of 'seminar/preaching' so in a nutshell then my main response to her is: don't go to the seminar! :shrug :heart

*bowing out now* :whistle

[grandmama]

And I am not encouraging staying or leaving a church, only pointing out that there is a big difference between a church officially hosting a speaker and people in a church having different views on things!

I think we are on the same page, really!

[TulipMama]

If you are interested in more about what others have done with Tripp at their church, check out these links. (KnittedInTheWomb is a member here, though I haven't seen her posting in awhile. She had a lot about Tripp on the old board.):

http://messageboards.ivillage.com/n/mb/message.asp?webtag=iv-ppezzo&msg=4623.5

http://myblogginess.blogspot.com/2005/02/im-tripping-out.html

http://messageboards.ivillage.com/n/find/results.asp?webtag=iv-ppezzo&ctx=search&o=newest&af=365&be=0&f=this&qu=tripp

[schoolofmom]

I have found a very interesting article by Dennis Prager, which notes that the name God gives Jacob and His Choosen People is “Israel”, which literally means “Struggle with God.” Many people argued or struggled with God, and did not met Mr. Tripp’s without challenge, without excuse and without delay criteria. So if God does not require it of us as adults why are we requiring it of our children?

I love this quote! (from the middle link)